What size and brand/model of the P rated tires did you compare?

 

Original was the Hankooks, first attempt was the the Firestone destination LE in 265/70R17. Unfortunately got talked into them by the tire dealer even though I was looking for an LT. Then went to the Goodyear LT275/70R17 Silent Armour LR C. Far better.

 

Kingfish51, we have a problem here.

You have been a very active participant here with over 4,000 posts to your name and especially active in the "Wheels, Tires, Brakes" forum where you have been a very vocal opponent of installing P series tires on ANY F-150. You have been anti-P series for many years.

Now you claim you have ownership/driving experience with the Firestone LE in P265/70/17 but have never made reference to this tire in any of your thousands of posts. You have posted an average of 2 posts a day for the last 6 years and you never ONCE mentioned these tires? That alone is highly suspicious. But why would the person who has been the long-term most vocal opponent of P-series tires get talked into running a P-series tire by a tire salesaman??? Not gonna happen.

And to hit the final nail in the coffin, here is proof of your dishonesty:



What does it mean? It means you are dishonest about your driving experience with a P rated tire that had a load rating over 2500 lbs. I don't like dishonesty, especially not when the dishonesty is done in an attempt to protect your credibility.

Are you going to come clean or dig yourself deeper into the pit of lies?

 

It means that I went to a p series I did not like then went to something worthwhile. After being talked into it by the dealer, they were taken back very quickly, a few days. I was not about to keep something I was very unhappy with. Fortunately for me they took them back. If they would not have, it would have been the last I would have done business with them, and I had done a good bit of business with them before. The Goodyear is what I ended up with.
After that experience, I am even more sure that the P series tires are worthless on a LT.
Before very careful before you call someone a liar. If you do not like the facts, do not call someone a liar.

 

I'm new to this forum but long time member of others. Some picked up on what I asked for which was a LT tire I know what I'm using it for and that I would need a C or higher tire. Also in my personal experience a P rated tire is fine if you plan to use it for that a Passenger vehicle and even if I didn't farm and do other heavy towing I'd still drive a pickup and then Ps would be fine but if you plan to use it tow and haul to its GVWR I wouldn't suggest doing it on P tires. When your pulling a load and the wind starts to push you sideways your gonna want an overrated tire that will stay stiff compared to one that is at its limits. I've owned 5 F150s now and all have been swapped to LTs. Starting to get to the point were I'm going to see if the dealership would just swap out tires before I ever leave the lot. Only good OEM tires i've had were Wranglers on the 03FX4. My 08 F250 came with continentals I think they might be tied with the hankooks for worst stock tires i've had.

 

Hey, I didn't call you a liar, your own post history did. You clearly said you replaced the OEM Hankooks with the Goodyear SilentArmor. Now you are claiming to have magically experienced a heavier-duty P rated tire in between the two, something that is not compatible with your earlier statements. It is also not compatible with your post history before you supposedly mounted the P-rated Firestone Destination because you were strongly against P series tires on a truck before that time.

I had a strong sense you were going to dig yourself deeper and I was right. It's getting deeper in here and one would have to be the gullible type to not see through it.

 

Honestly you are not worth any more of my time. And yes you did call me a liar, without any facts. I have given the OP the advice he wanted. That is all that is needed.

 

Without any facts? LOL!

I presented your post from the time period in question where you say you replaced the OEM Hankooks with Goodyear Silent Armors (not Firestone Destinations).

What do you consider proof? A notorized document? LOL! I suppose it's possible someone hacked your account to create a bogus post history, LOL!

You have NO integrity left!

 

Real; I don't care too much about all your other bickering with other members, but I do have a comment about P vs LT's. All you keep pointing to is the load rating but that alone does not define how a tire will behave with a given load. LT tires are deigned with stronger sidewalls to minimize sway associated with taller aspect ratios. A P rated tire may not blow out with 2500 pounds on it, but it will be more unstable. Load ratings are not the tell all number that you are claiming them to be.

Others have already posted their personal experiences here that you seem to ignore. Going from a P to a C, or C to E (as I did) will make a noticeable difference in how the truck handles a heavy load. Nobody has said the P will blow-out instantly, just that it will not perform as well as an LT. If you don't haul or tow much then have fun with your P's. They generally will offer a smoother ride and less noise. But since alot of us use our trucks for heavy loads we will stick with tires designed for such loads.

 

It's the result of someone telling lies in an attempt to shore up their position that is not supported by the facts. If calling them out on their deceptions is "bickering", then so be it.

Correct. The load rating is just one aspect that can provide a clue as to how a tire will perform.

In general this is true because LT rated tires also tend to have higher load ratings. But a P rated tire with a higher (equalized) load rating than a particular LT rated tire will likely have stronger sidewalls and less sway (even though it is rated in the P series). My point is that the load rating is a better predictor of lateral stability than what series the manufacturer decided to market the tire in. Keep in mind, the biggest difference between the the two rating systems is simply that the P series load ratings must be multiplied by .91 to be able to compare apples to apples.

This is true. As you move up the load range the tire tends to become more laterally rigid. I do not ignore personal experiences but what we have is a lot of people comparing the very marginal P-rated OEM tires with a much higher rated LT tire. The only person to have claimed to compare a higher load rated P-series tire with a lower rated LT series tire was caught fabricating a story to support his almost religious like beliefs.

My point all along is that there is nothing magical about a tire that a manufacturer decided to rate in the LT tire system. In Europe a continuous rating system is used, they do not have two systems. The two rating system in the US has some overlap between the P series and LT series. And you will note that the P series tires with the largest sizes and highest load ratings are obviously designed for light trucks because cars do not have enough room in the fender wells to fit these tires. In short, a tires performance has more to do with the (equalized) load rating than whether the manufacturer decided to rate it in the P series or the LT series.

I will grant you this: For a given make/model/size of tire one rated in the LT rating system will be more laterally rigid than the same make/model/size rated in the P system. But (and this is important) it will also have a higher equalized load rating.

You are correct when you say the load rating does not define all aspects of the performance of a tire. But whether a manufacturer decides to market a transitional tire in the P system or the LT system has even less to do with the tires performance than does the (equalized) load rating.

I don't mind discussing this on a truthful level, and listening to others subjective experiences, but I have to draw the line when people start making stuff up out of thin air in an attempt to appear to have some experience in an area where they have none (not in reference to you but to Bigfish51).

Peace.

 

I guess I'm a "Liar" too, by Real's defination.....

I too replaced the OEM tires when I first got my truck from a P235/70/16 to a P255/70/16 and hated them! I took them back and got a credit on them for LT265/75/16 tires... I don't mention the fact that I had those P rated tires each time I say I'm running my current tire...

It didn't take me too long to realize that those P rated tires were not going to hack it, even for everyday driving, as they just didn't have the stability I expected from driving a truck....

At least the OP has figured it out too, so I guess we all have to profess all the changes we did to our rigs when we post so that the 'facts' are straight......

Mitch

 

Mitch, not at all. I'm sorry if I said ANYTHING that made you think this.

I agree 100%. It may surprise you to learn that I too got rid of the crappy OEM tires within the first month. I still have them stacked in my garage. They are for sale if anyone wants them but I do not recommend them for a F-150. They have very thin sidewalls and are designed for maximum EPA mileage figures. The P series tires I replaced them with have a much higher load rating and weigh 13 more lbs. per tire.

Now it drives and corners like a truck should and I have adequate safety margin if I ever overload the truck beyond it's rated capacity (for the tires at least).

I strongly recommend derating all tires from the sidewall markings (not just P series although they need to be de-rated 9% more than LT ratings if you want to compare apples to apples).

However, you do not want to go too far down this path because there are numerous disadvantages to tires in the wrong application and this is true whether the tire is too light for the job or too heavy.

It would seem intuitive that a high pressure LR E tire would have less rolling resistance but that is not the case. It does have less sidewall flex but there is a lot more sidewall material flexing a smaller distance. The net result is more energy dissipated, more rolling resistance and more fuel burned.

Also, the heavier, less resilient tires cause more wear on bearings, brakes, steering and suspension components and increase stopping distances. This is not a reason to run an inadequate tire but it is a good reason to avoid derating the tire excessively. Heavier duty is only better to a point, then it becomes a liability.

Use a tire suited to your application. But do not make the mistake of thinking that no P-rated tire is adequate for any F-150 simply because the OEM P rated tires are so wimpy.

 

Real, I know you didn't call me out on this specifically, I was just saying that I had P rated tires that I purchased then ditched them for the LT's not long after.. That's how I interpret what King did as well??

It just sounded to me you were/are reading more into Kings posts based on the fact that he too purchased P rated tires, ditched them for LT's and doesn't mention it every time he posts info regarding running P tires compared to LT tires...

I too am against running P tires on a truck for the most part, but you are right in that you must decide what you are going to use your truck for and decide from there... Like my Dad. He just picked up a 2008 F150 STX with the V6 and 2wd. Heck, it only has vinyl floor covering! It's a reg cab and he put a canopy on it. It's basically going to be used for hauling his golf clubs to the course when he's in Arizona for the winter... He will do just fine with the OEM P rated tires he has on it down there.

I realize you two (you and King) were getting all 'techie' and all and that's fine and what you were calling King out on, but it's up to the OP to decide if any info gained on the internet is viable info and not take any of it as 'Gospel' without confirming what you read....

Mitch

 

Well said. Thanks. We have to leave people room for their opinion, otherwise, why would we discuss anything?

 

No, there's a big difference but to understand it you need to first understand that "P" and "LT" are not ratings (in and of themselves) but rather two different sizing/rating systems. The history of these two systems is beyond the scope of this discussion but suffice it to say that tires within the "P" and "LT" rating systems have different load ratings and different sidewall stiffnesses and the LT series and P series overlap in the middle. The European rating system uses one continuous system, from the lightest car all the way to heavy-duty trucks.

I suggested that Kingfish51 had never driven an F-150 wearing P series tires rated over 2500 lbs. (2300 lbs. derated) at 35 psi. He claimed he had but that they didn't work very well. When I asked which tires he used he said Firestone Destination (after he removed the OEM Hankooks and before he bought the Wrangler SilentArmor). I then pulled up a post where he said he had just replaced the stock Hankooks with the Wrangler Silent Armors, proving that he was not being honest. He made up the story about the Firstone Destinations in order to pretend like he had firsthand experience with a P series tire rated for higher loads than the OEM tires. In reality, he was just comparing the wimpy OEM tires with a tire with a much higher load rating.


If your dad's truck came with the same OEM tires mine did, I would still recommend replacing them with something better (even if the only cargo will be golf clubs). I found the OEM tires to be seriously lacking in sidewall stiffness. They are designed primarly to score high on the EPA fuel mileage tests.