Mike,

I bought a Superchip from you in late 2001. 2 weeks ago my truck broke down and it turns out the computer is bad. I have not had the chip in for over a year because of high gas prices. I was told today that Ford will not warranty the computer because the chip was installed at one point in time and the coating on the contacts where the chip goes was removed. Any help you can give me before I call Ford to complain would be of Great Help.

Ray Lilla '01 F150 7700 5.4 Lariat 4x4 comp code ILM3

 

Hi Ray,

Ouch, sorry to hear you're having a problem!

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to tell the chip couldn't have contributed to that in any way in that scenario, but many times dealerships don't know the details of how that J3 circuit works, as it's not a "serviceable" part on their end, thus they many times don't know much about it, and the fact that it's redundant (meaning not used at any time unless a chip is attached), etc. The bottom line is, that dealership is just using that as an excuse - and I can just guess who you probably won't be buying your next vehicle from!

PCM's are like any other part, in that they certainly can and do fail sometimes - and when it happens like that, it seems like there's no "reason" for it - but there is. With PCM's usually it's a failed cold solder joint, or sometimes a particular component will fail - it happens with PCM's just like any other part (electronic or not) from time to time, basically.

I do need to point out here that your documentation that we provide with every Superchip module we ship points out how to get help, which is to please call us right away -

It's probably been a good while since you read those docs, as you've had your chip for a long time now - just so you'll know, our docs specifically instruct *not* to report problems to us by posting on the message boards of F-150 Online, or in email, etc., because we can't help you properly here. So just for future reference, any time you need or want help of any kid related to your Superchip, Tech Support, etc., that can only be done by phone, so please give us a call right away.

You'll find that gone over in detail in our docs in the section titled "Troubleshooting Tips in the Event of a “No-Start” & How to Get Technical Support." In that section, we mention to please call us *before* the vehicle goes to the dealership if possible, as there are some situations in which we can potentially help you to perhaps avoid such a situation - once the vehicle is already in the hands of the dealer, you have fewer options. This is just some general FYI stuff. If you no longer have your original documentation from us, or may have misplaced it, etc., please let us know when you call & we will send you a new set so you'll have it handy for future reference.

At any rate, we'll need to do this by phone Ray, so please do give us a call when you get a chance so we can go over everything in proper detail with you. Since this is Friday afternoon and we close at 6 pm Eastern time, I want to let you know that you can still call us even when we're closed to leave a message specifically for Tech Support - you'll hear the instructions in the recording in our voice mail system, it's extension #22 you need to dial to leave messages specifically for Tech Support. That way we'll know someone has called & needs a call back over the weekend - if you don't leave the message *specifically* for Tech Support @ extension 22, then it goes over into normal sales calls, and gets returned after the weekend. I'd like to talk with you as soon as is reasonable possible, and I'm sure you want to reach me as soon as you can, too!

Talk to you soon Ray & hang in there,

 

Thanks Mike. I didn't even have the chance to pull out the paperwork that came with the chip. This failure is in no way due to the chip since it hasn't even been in the truck for a year and a half.

I am an electronics tech by trade and know what you say is 100% correct about components. The dealer just looks for any excuse to deny the claim. The only good thing is that my insurance company is going to bat for me since I have mechanical breakdown coverage. They are sending out an investigator to see what is the exact cause of the failure. They won't really even know unless they come with a schematic, multimeter, the BOM for the board, and an o-scope. Ten to one says that I could probably even fix the damn thing myself.

I will call you Mike. Once again, thanks for your help.

Ray Lilla

 

Raylilla2,

I think most of us who have or have had chips in our trucks would be interested in the outcome of this as well. I can understand why a distributor wouldn't want the publicity in a forum (no offense MT) but if it can help somebody else out, why not share the information. My 2 cents....

 

Hello milchuck,

Ok, I'm going to clear this up right now.........

This has absolutely nothing to do with us somehow trying to hide something, or somehow stop this from being talked about here. That is not even remotely close to the truth - and couching that implication with "no offense MT" doesn't change anything - your implication paints us as somehow trying to hush this up, not wanting this to be discussed, etc. - whether or not you actually meant to, that is the obvious and direct implication, and is dead wrong.

The fact is, it is against the vendor rules of this web site for vendors to provide Tech Support to their customers here on these message boards. The Webmaster here understandably does not want the very expensive bandwidth this ultra-high volume web site requires to be wasted on matters that have nothing to do with F-150 Online. Matters that are of a nature that are between a vendor and their customer are generally required to be kept between the 2 parties - those have always been part of the vendor rules of the site - at least, as long as I can remember.

I have been here for 5+ years now - almost as long as this site has existed, and during that time issues like this (and just about anything else) have been discussed here any number of times - in fact, if you're interested in this you'll want to use the search feature to retrieve those previous threads (they go back a ways) and read them, too. Just FYI..........

Last.......Ray is a heck of a nice guy that I think the world of, and who I can only hope has not been made to feel bad about his original post, as we know his intentions are certainly good - and he knows that he is *more* than welcome to post anything he cares to regarding his experiences on this.

Tech Support (or "help" or whatever else anyone calls it) for any products purchased from us can only be done over the phone or in person - not on the Internet, and not in email. Which Ray did in fact do just very shortly after I wrote my post - within just a few minutes after that post he called and we had a very nice conversation. He's an all-around nice guy, the kind whose phone calls are always a pleasure - heck, he diagnosed the problem correctly in a relatively few minutes, where it took his dealership service department days to confirm his diagnosis. Ray is a level-headed fellow who knows a great deal about electronics & electronic devices of many kinds in general, as that is his profession - he knows a good deal about the manufacturing process of PCB's (printed circuit boards), too - so as you might imagine, given the commonalities between his background and some of what we do here, I greatly enjoy getting a chance to talk with him.

The bottom line is, Ray will post whatever *he* feels is appropriate to post here about this - with our blessings. I'd never want him to feel he wasn't welcome to do so.


At any rate, I hope this clears things up for you Milchuck, & enjoy your weekend..............

 

No need to get all defensive, there was no disparagement intended. I don't think I used the words "hide" or "hush" even once. Unlike in another thread (Is a Superchip worth the money) where you implied I had "difficulty installing my chip" and that was the cause of my Superchip problems. To the contrary, the chip was installed perfectly and remained firmly seated (and taped down) to the ecu, however, still failed on multiple occasions. I'd just like to see either Superchips or a distributor actually admit that there are some problems with the F-150 install with these chips instead of continually blaming the truck owner's installation when a problem occurs.

Moving on, we will have to "agree to disagree" that Ray's issue has nothing to do with this forum. It seems these forums cover a wide range of subjects....folks passing along useful (and not so useful) information on just about anything and everything regarding their F-150's. Certainly an owner having an aftermarket item (i.e. SuperChip) potentially voiding their vehicle warranty is a huge issue for all of us who have purchased one. I was just encouraging the guy to let us know how it goes as sharing the information might help the next guy who runs into a similar problem with their dealership. THAT is what these forums should be all about...helping each other!

In addition, I don't think it matters if someone's been on here 5 years or 5 minutes, they both should have equal standing to comment without being verbally skewered, regardless of their "status" as a new member, senior member, supporting vendor, etc.

Hope this "clears things up" for you as well. Have a good weekend!

 

Ray, if you would please keep us updated on whats going on with your situation, I know I would appreciate it, as well as others.

 

Mike, I'm curious....

What would have happened if he had updated the PCM with a 1715, and the PCM went bad?

Isnt the 1715 going to be 'locked' if he cant retrieve/restore the the respective code-sets? When the new PCM is installed, how would you flash it with the 1715 at that point?

 

Maybe I can clarify a little also.. It's not that Ray's post has nothing to do with this forum per se, it is that his issue and what he needs to do with his problem is. Ray can post all he wants about his findings at anytime, both good and bad, along with any and all technical advice/support he may have received as a member, but Mike T or any other vendor doesn't have those same liberties. That's common with any sight of this size and nature. He's not trying to hide, quite the contrary actually..

It may seem clear as mud, but it's just a way of keeping sites like this fair and clear of the legalities that can take away from the true nature.

Basically, Ray is the one that will be relied upon to post his findings at this point...

edit - and no flame intended...

 

Agreed. You can probably sense the "frustration" in my reply as I was feeling a bit attacked when I wrote it. My apologies. Hopefully Ray will fill us in on what he finds out.

Chuck

 

Just to add another note to this thread. It was mentioned that Mike doesn’t always “admit” to problems with installs of his products, specifically the Superchip. What I would say is every install is unique because it is with a different person. Some will do it with no problem at all and follow the instructions completely and others may have a hard time with the install for what ever reason. It may be as simple as not completely understanding the instructions, or proper cleaning. Cleaning the contacts correctly and thoroughly is key to proper operation, failure to do so is the leading cause of problems.

In any regards if the same experienced person was always doing the install then there would never be a problem, thus no reason for Mike to mention “possible” problems with installs because he can not foresee every possible situation and determine the level of experience with each individual that is usually the reason a phone number is part of the instructions. I would think it may state something like “For any problems or assistance please call ******”

I have read many of Mike’s post and they are very detailed and helpful so I can only imagine what his customer service on the phone must be like…

 

Not to fan the flames on what should already be a dead issue, but if you read my post you'll see I never said that. I don't know what Mr Troyer does or doesn't admit to as I don't know him and have never dealt with his company. I only can surmise from reading his posts on here that he is very knowledgable with the products he sells, as any good businessman would be, and seems eager to help people with their issues and concerns.

The main point I had been trying to make is, that for some reason, some folks seem to be in denial of the fact a chip could be faulty from the manufacturer or could malfunction even after it is properly installed. When a problem occurs, they always assume it was installed improperly. I would agree the percentage of faulty chips is probably very small, but I know it happens, no question. One of my main hobbies is building computers so I am very familiar with the fragility of any component (i.e. video/sound card, memory chips, etc) that uses these types of metal contacts to transfer information. They will malfunction due to all types of problems, not the least of which is a faulty diode or static electricity. As such, I have run across brand new components, right out of the box, that were dead or faulty once installed and we never know what happened to make it that way. These performance chips are just smaller cousins of computer components and relay information through the exact same type of contacts that computer components do. Since your vehicle ecu is nothing more than a computer anyway, one should expect the same kind of failures to occur on occasion.

I just wanted to make the point of not to assume everytime a piece of equipment fails to bring about the desired result, it must be operator error. It certainly wasn't in my case.

 

To properly diagnose any problem you must first retrace the steps taken to install. You go over them 1 by 1 to make sure they were followed. As mentioned you must assume that the installer has basic knowledge of what he is attempting to do. It is not intended as an insult to the installer but a basic diagnostic procedure. Even highly trained individuals make mistakes. Once the install steps are iliminated as a probable cause then the actual diagnosis of the hardware/software can begin. To jump these basic steps will lead to misdiagnosis.

Respectfully

Jean Marc Chartier

 

Double post - sorry.

 

Milchuck,

I'm having a hard time with your contradictions and tactics...............

"I think I'll have to go on the record now and say I think Superchips customer service STINKS! And since I posted last, I learned from the distributor I bought the chip from that the stalling problem with the chips is "an inherent problem" as the Ford ECU bracket can get in between the chip and the ECU causing it to lose contact and interfering with its operation. There is a simple work-around that a couple of people have already mentioned that requires bending or removing the small lip built onto the ECU mounting bracket. This was something Superchips failed to mention and not only that, when I sent them an email in August after my first problem, they told me they had not had ANY problems of this kind with F-150's" (posted 10/7/03, edited 10/11/03)

(By the way, I'm just curious - since this distributor was so knowledgeable that he was able to tell you all about the lip on the mounting bracket - why didn't he bother telling you that BEFORE you did the installation, so you could have AVOIDED this entire situation?)

I responded in the other thread in pointing out specifically what you had complained about - which was the lip on the support bracket for the PCM, as can clearly be seen in your post - So I went over that potential issue quite clearly in the post I made to which you are referring, as well as discussing the 8 people in their phone support room having to support *thousands* of different applications, thus not any one of them is ever going to know as much about the ins & outs of installing them in the late-model F-150 as *we* do for a number of obvious reasons - not the least of which is just what I said - they have *thousands* of applications to support, where we specialize in this specific platform thus we *know* all the ins & outs of the installation of the Superchip module better than anyone I am aware of, including the manufacturer. And so we write very detailed and thorough documentation for our customers to avoid such problems. And I went over all of that in detail in that other thread. Only to have you response with:

".............To the contrary, the chip was installed perfectly and remained firmly seated (and taped down) to the ecu, however, still failed on multiple occasions. I'd just like to see either Superchips or a distributor actually admit that there are some problems with the F-150 install with these chips instead of continually blaming the truck owner's installation when a problem occurs. (11/22/03)

Uh-huh - right. You also seem to know nothing about what symptoms are even possible when there actually *is* a problem with the Superchip module - the symptoms you reported here aren't among them.

On 10/7/03 you *knew* that it was not a problem with the Superchip itself but was instead a simple matter of a lip on the support bracket for the PCM that was interfering (and thus on occasion interrupting the connection between the PCM and the Superchip) - just as you said yourself in your post! But yet over a month later on 11/22, right in this very thread, after knowing the truth because you were told about this by your distributor, you completely ignore the truth so you can once again try to point the finger at the Superchip itself - when you already *know* it has nothing to do with the Superchip, but instead was the lip on the bracket and had already *posted* that fact.

You can't have it both ways.

And of course, I really like how you chose to ignore what was in my original post about what Ray posted, as well as my response to you - you completely ignore the fact that we simply pointed out that this is not the place or the way to report a problem to us, as Tech Support cannot be done here - yet you of course ignore this to then go on with this lame attempt at obfuscation:

"Moving on, we will have to "agree to disagree" that Ray's issue has nothing to do with this forum. It seems these forums cover a wide range of subjects...."

Once again, that has *nothing* to do with what I said in my post, which was:

"I do need to point out here that your documentation that we provide with every Superchip module we ship points out how to get help, which is to please call us right away."

I then also went on to say:

"You'll find that gone over in detail in our docs in the section titled "Troubleshooting Tips in the Event of a “No-Start” & How to Get Technical Support." In that section, we mention to please call us *before* the vehicle goes to the dealership if possible, as there are some situations in which we can potentially help you to perhaps avoid such a situation..........."

I also said in my response to your next post - you remember, the one in which you made the implication that we somehow were trying to keep this quiet:

"This has absolutely nothing to do with us somehow trying to hide something, or somehow stop this from being talked about here. That is not even remotely close to the truth - and couching that implication with "no offense MT" doesn't change anything - your implication paints us as somehow trying to hush this up, not wanting this to be discussed, etc. - whether or not you actually meant to, that is the obvious and direct implication, and is dead wrong. The fact is, it is against the vendor rules of this web site for vendors to provide Tech Support to their customers here on these message boards. The Webmaster here understandably does not want the very expensive bandwidth this ultra-high volume web site requires to be wasted on matters that have nothing to do with F-150 Online. Matters that are of a nature that are between a vendor and their customer are generally required to be kept between the 2 parties - those have always been part of the vendor rules of the site - at least, as long as I can remember."

And of course I then went on at length explaining to you in great detail that whatever Ray choose to post about this experience is purely up to him - only to have you trying to pull that lame "we will have to agree to disagree" that Ray's issue has nothing to do with this forum," which of course has absolutely *nothing* to do with what I said.

And what really floors me is the fact that your documentation you got with that Superchip *clearly* states to call Superchips at 407-260-0838 - yet you rail on and on about how you were completely ignored IN EMAIL - How many times does it take to make it understood that for Tech Support YOU NEED TO PICK UP THE PHONE AND CALL?? Which is why both their docs and ours say to do just that - CALL if you need help?

You know, I'll bet if you and I had a chance to sit down over a cup of coffee & talk shop we'd probably get along just fine. But right now, overall - I'd have to say it appears you're a long way from being in any position to point fingers at anyone.

I wish you well, Milchuck - I mean that.