Bought a Jacobs RV UltraTeam today... arrives next week. I'll let you know how disappointed... or not... I am after the install (expecting great things--especially on my '91/302.)


-Mike

 

Mike,

My unit has been great. It's already more than paid for itself in fuel savings, and the truck runs stronger.

Which unit did you end up getting? Coil/wires?

BTW, one of the only challenges in the hook up is where to put the unit. After checking it out, I decided to put it on top of the inner fender next to the battery. I moved the vacuum canister over slightly and mounted the ignition. The "trigger" went on the firewall near the stock coil. The new coil wire was routed along the intake and secured with a couple of zip ties.

I think the gap Jacobs recommended as a starting point on my '95 was .060 and that is close to optimal from the testing I have done.

You may want to track your mileage until the unit comes in. As a note, my mileage increase with the unit is slightly higher as a percentage in the summer. Seems my truck doesn't like the winter gas formulation regardless of ignition system. On the up side, winter is usually the only time my average (mostly in town) doesn't exceed 15 mpg. Not bad for mostly in town on an extended cab 4x4.

 

Signmaster,

Thanks for your reply. I'm really excited about the unit. It is the RV Ultrateam. Coil, ignition computer, hill module, wires. I pulled the plugs this afternoon and cleaned and regapped them to the recommended 0.064". We'll see how that works. I was toying with the idea of buying new plugs, but want to see how the system does with the old ones before moving up to a better set of plugs when these are due for replacement (about 10,000 more miles.)

The gains aren't all that impressive for $380--10% power and torque, 15% mileage. A chip could do the same for $230. BUT we will see how this works, and use it as a starting point for other mods (chip, cam, exhaust, intake.) It sure is easy to spend too much money on an old half-ton pickup, eh?

Installation worries me--hate drilling the truck, and not sure where I am going to locate the components. I'll keep your suggestions in mind.

Hopefully the improvement will be worthwhile and will solve some of the 302s weaknesses. Will be pulling about 6,700 pounds of gooseneck horse trailer--so look forward to the result. I'll post what happens when the unit arrives/is installed this week.

-Mike

 

True, you can only do so much with a single mod. If you consider the options, the ignition becomes much more attractive.

My cat back cost $400 (stainless) made less improvement in power and little to nothing in mileage.

My intake mods were done myself, helped power and no mileage gain. Still a good bang for the buck, just the cost of a drop in K&N filter.

My pulleys helped power some, but it seems mostly at higher revs. They did help mileage a little bit, and only cost $100.

I don't have a chip. Consider that gas costs on average 20% more for premium. Even if you do get a mileage increase (as some report) you are stil raising fuel costs 15% or so. Compare this to spending more on the ignition initially, but saving 15% on fuel rather than paying an extra 15%. Take your fuel bill annually and then figure the 30% difference.

As a note I'm note against chips, but the theory that they are the best bang for the buck just doesn't fly IMO. They do take care of several things with one product, but at the expense of increased operating costs.


Sounds like you have a nice unit on the way. They didn't have the ones with the uphill modules when I got mine. I think they work similar to the Pro Street module with the sensor. Under certain conditions you get increased spark.

As for the install concerns, that's why I choose the location I did. Easy to drill and easy to get to. There also seems to be plenty of room under the washer reservoir. Let us know how the install goes and how you like the unit....

 

Alrighty... Not impressed with Summit Racing. I got the first kit, and tried installing only to find that I was missing parts (it was a return that they repacked and sent me.)

The second kit is still missing parts (spark plug wire clips that are used in building the distributor wire.) Jacobs is sending me those... but still missing some nuts and bolts and things. The second kit is also missing the instructions manual... Hmm...

I have finally gotten the kit nearly installed, and it has not been an easy process. I moved the vacuum canister over a hole and wedged the computer in between the two cans on the left fenderwell. IMO, the computer is much too large.... I routed the green wire for the secondary trigger by the AC and along the firewall, then down to the unit's mounting position on the stock coil support (just happened to have a bolt that it would fit upon).

Finally, (still working) I will mount the coil on the brace that supports the windshield washer/coolant reservoirs tomorrow morning when I can find someone with good enough drill bits to drill a couple of mounting holes.

The installation will be fairly tidy except for the mounting location of the computer unit... I'll just have to feel guilty about that, because there's really nowhere else to put it. Maybe I'll relocate the vacuum canisters later when I have lots of free time.

Have not road tested the unit yet--will do so this weekend after mounting the coil and will let you know my impressions. The truck starts and runs with the unit installed, but I can't tell any increase in throttle response just from jumping on the accelerator in the driveway.

Glad I installed the kit--found a spark plug that had cracked that I would not have found otherwise (amazing how fast a fella can move when he sees a long blue arc along a cracked plug.)

Hope to feel some improvement in the truck... not sure if the $400 I spent is worth it just yet, but the kit says it is working and I haven't blown anything up just yet...

-Mike

 

OOoopps..... I feel guilty now, for not remembering this before. It hit me when you mentioned the two canisters to work around.

My initial mount moved just the vacuum canister. Later I decided I wanted a more solid and if nothing else "cleaner" install. I removed the small canister, which is nothing more than a silencer/filter for the air injector pump.

Also, my unit is the coil over box type, so I only had to find a place to mount the box. Most likely, you are like I was... anxious to check it out.

My low end increases were immediately evident and better than any other mod on the truck. Mid range and top end improved, but not as much by the SOTP meter. I also did some timed tests on my favorite on ramp than confirmed the improvements. Since the unit is so easy to switch over, you might want to try the same.

Let us know how phase two of your install goes and your initial impressions.

 

Not sure just what to think yet--I'll have to reconnect things that old way and remind myself how the truck performed before the mods. I have been driving the Impala for the past week, so haven't had much time in the truck (it's been inop till last night.)

Initial impressions... the truck seems to shift much more now, but seems to perform better in the mid range. I'm taking a trip up to near Atlanta this afternoon, so will get more of a feel for things on the way...

All in all, I'm not sure if I'm impressed or not. The real test will come when towing.

More later...

-Mike

 

any difference in mpg?

 

Seems to be a slight mpg improvement... and maybe a little performance improvement, BUT the truck does definitely seem a bit shiftier.

When you installed your unit, where/how could you tell your performance improved? I'd have to re-gap the plugs to tell if there's any improvement in the truck... I can't remember it liking to shift so much.

Might be wires going bad... or a bad connection between a wire and a plug, although I didn't feel any shudder which would normally indicate one cylinder being "off."

What gap did you use with your unit? They recommended .064"; normal is .044". Maybe too much gap?

-Mike

 

Did a "scientific test" this evening...

Just removing the Jacobs from the loop, I did notice the truck is slower accelerating and has less pep. With the Jacobs installed, I noticed the truck accelerated well at part throttle, and had more low-end (if I tried to accelerate at about 1000 RPM without the Jacobs, the truck shifted... if I did the same with Jacobs, the truck slowly accelerated without shifting down.) A 45-55mph run up a hill was significantly quicker with the Jacobs (5 seconds without, about 4 with--that's a pretty big difference so I'm not totally convinced if the Jacobs was the sole difference in that test--maybe wind or maybe a bit different incline.)

SO... Guess I'll keep the unit. For $375, I'm not as impressed as I'd expected to be BUT as I've said before the true test will come when I pull the horse trailer for the first time. I'll letcha know.

If the gap makes a big difference, it might be worth trying less than the suggested .064" in favor of maybe .054".


-Mike

 

Mike,

My stock gap on my '95 is .053, the gap recommended by Jacobs was .060. I worked up, and settled at .065.

As for where I noticed the improvements... just about everywhere. Starting and high revs didn't seem to be affected, but my truck always started quick and the 302 likes to rev even in stock form. Other than that, just about everything seemed to have improved. The truck ran smoother, look obviously less gas pedal to hold a set speed, and would pull without downshifting better.

I get the impression that you are (and I was too) somewhat skeptical. This was one of the reasons I went with the Jacobs, the 30 day "no questions asked" return.

In those 30 days, I made sure I didn't waste money. I did several different tests, such as the one you did. I tracked mileage. I unplugged the unit a couple of times for a day and then plugged it back in. I kept it...

As for the "hill" test, try some more. One of the ones I did was on an uphill on ramp, testing speed between two points rather than times. With the ignition I consistently pull 8-10 more mph by the top of the ramp, and have to back off to merge with traffic.

The same applies to mileage. A couple of times I thought the unit wasn't doing it's job. Then I would unplug it for the next tank and show a mileage drop every time. Actually I can drive the truck hard with the unit and still bet better mileage than "granny" driving without it.


Do some more tests, especially with your trailer since that was your primary concern. Believe me, if I wasn't convinced mine would have gone back. There are a lot more things I can do with $400.

 

Well... the bottom line. I didn't see any improvement whatsoever, so I removed the Jacobs and spent the evening re-gapping spark plugs back to standard specification. We'll see how easy it will be to return the unit. The truck actually performed better stock than it did with the Jacobs, so I'm not impressed at the waste of time/money.

This link verifies my SOTP impressions:
http://www.se-r.net/engine/ignition.html

Might try the unit once more, this time with standard gap. If improvement is noticed, then I'll increase gap a little bit--but I'm not sure I really want to take all those plugs out again... takes too much time.

 

Discussed the problem with Jacobs today, and he says the unit is probably defective... so off it goes to Summit Racing in the morning. If they have a unit for EEC-IV specifically, with wires, I'll give it a shot... otherwise will wait awhile before trying another unit or an MSD... I'll keep ya posted.

Jacobs' customer service, so far, has been excellent. We'll see if Summit agrees to take the return...

-Mike

 

Read elsewhere on hop ups for 302/351w that ignition performance kits are a big waste

 

Mike,

Do you think the unit was working and then quit? Just curious, your impressions seemed to up/down/not sure. Did you ever do any timed tests and/or mileage comparisons?

Either way, if you don't like it return it. I wouldn't trade mine but different years, calibrations, etc could make a difference.

Also, just for future ref. I found out after buying my unit that Jacobs will match the Summit price. No use dealing with a middle man if you try another box type. You might also want to check with Jacobs.... I was under the impression that all the newer kits had the coil mounted over the box. I wonder if you got an older return or something....?