More Street Racing Death...
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From: Elkton, MD
I heard about this. They were saying that the movie "Fast and Furious" may be related to the recent street racing.
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99 Lightning- JL equipped! JL Ram Air, JL Daiblo Chip,90mm MAF,JL Power Cooler, Level 10 shift kit,PSP Lower pulley, Single Blade T/B, Bassani exhaust, NGK's. 12.42 at 109.6..Full trim and stock convertor, MT Street ET's.
New times w/ JL converter coming soon!
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99 Lightning- JL equipped! JL Ram Air, JL Daiblo Chip,90mm MAF,JL Power Cooler, Level 10 shift kit,PSP Lower pulley, Single Blade T/B, Bassani exhaust, NGK's. 12.42 at 109.6..Full trim and stock convertor, MT Street ET's.
New times w/ JL converter coming soon!
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From: NJ
It's sad that people their age would not have enough sense to not do that in traffic. Thats all the younger generation needs to see, is older people doing the same thing.
And who in their right mind would race a Lamborgini in traffic? If had that car I would drive as slow as possible just to ensure that everyone sees me in it.
And who in their right mind would race a Lamborgini in traffic? If had that car I would drive as slow as possible just to ensure that everyone sees me in it.
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From: Rock Springs, WY, USA
That is too bad!!
It is awful when some idiot decides to race on a busy street and kills someone who was not even involved.
I really hate when people try to blame the movies or music or anything other than the person at fault for something like this.
I saw the movie and I did not go out and street race after it. I did cruise around in the L, but did not hurt anyone.
It comes down to personal responsibility. There have been movies out forever that have depicted violence or antisocial behaviour and they have not caused the violence. It comes down to parents not teaching their children personal responsibility and then the courts allowing people to not take responsibility for their actions. Sure you can sue mcdonalds because you spilled your coffee or sue the filmakers because some idiot watched a movie and then recreated the crime.
It just makes me sick.
Sorry to rant
Paul
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2001 Silver Lightning, bedrug
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It is awful when some idiot decides to race on a busy street and kills someone who was not even involved.
I really hate when people try to blame the movies or music or anything other than the person at fault for something like this.
I saw the movie and I did not go out and street race after it. I did cruise around in the L, but did not hurt anyone.
It comes down to personal responsibility. There have been movies out forever that have depicted violence or antisocial behaviour and they have not caused the violence. It comes down to parents not teaching their children personal responsibility and then the courts allowing people to not take responsibility for their actions. Sure you can sue mcdonalds because you spilled your coffee or sue the filmakers because some idiot watched a movie and then recreated the crime.
It just makes me sick.
Sorry to rant
Paul
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2001 Silver Lightning, bedrug
Stock (except bedrug).....for now....but not for long...
My Wish List:
Air intake kit...psp on order
Lower Pulley...psp on order
Chip
Electric fan kit
Bassani full exhaust
Power Power Power....more to follow
also:
2000 Focus (wifes car)
1989 Jeep Cherokee (beater)
1953 Chevy (Project 1)
1931 Model A (Project 2)
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From: Clifton, NJ, USA
I'd be sure that was a who's got the bigger ******* race between those two cars...none the less, it is just as stupid.
I may take to the occasional bat of speed on the highway, but when it comes to traffic, whatever was going on is over...there is no need to risk the lives of those other motorists, wether or not you're willing to risk your own.
The only other thing is that the article called it "drag-racing"...um, if you're weaving in and out of traffic, you are not drag racing...you're just racing...and stupidly at that.
Daniel
I may take to the occasional bat of speed on the highway, but when it comes to traffic, whatever was going on is over...there is no need to risk the lives of those other motorists, wether or not you're willing to risk your own.
The only other thing is that the article called it "drag-racing"...um, if you're weaving in and out of traffic, you are not drag racing...you're just racing...and stupidly at that.
Daniel
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From: TAMPA FL
Here's a link to some of the pictures of that wreck. Be warned - these are very "raw", if you have a weak stomach don't look.
(LINK REMOVED AT WEBMASTER'S DISCRETION - THREAD WILL REMAIN, BUT CLOSED)
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Adam
01 Black Lightning - Newest Mod - Single Blade TB. JDM 'FlipChipenfiltered','Straightpiped', 'splitfired', 'billetted', 'Neoned', and 'Grooved' thanks to Blaupunkt, Alpine, Sony, Clarion, Dynomat, and MTX
[This message has been edited by webmaster (edited 06-25-2001).]
(LINK REMOVED AT WEBMASTER'S DISCRETION - THREAD WILL REMAIN, BUT CLOSED)
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Adam
01 Black Lightning - Newest Mod - Single Blade TB. JDM 'FlipChipenfiltered','Straightpiped', 'splitfired', 'billetted', 'Neoned', and 'Grooved' thanks to Blaupunkt, Alpine, Sony, Clarion, Dynomat, and MTX
[This message has been edited by webmaster (edited 06-25-2001).]
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Here's a link to another thread where it is being discussed. http://www.texags.com/main/reply.asp...77&forum_id=12 There is some interesting information in there regarding the law.
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From: Mobile, AL, USA
What does it take for me to tell you all that RACING that involves DEATH even if you weren't the wreckee or the wrecker, IS STILL YOUR FAULT as much as the other party's. We talked about this last week about the Acura driver who was racing a red lightning. You all just wanted to keep saying over and over that it wasn't the Lightning owners fault. WELL BS! IMMATURITY KILLS! You're at fault just as much as the other one.
To quote from the lawyer on that other thread above:
BfB
[This message has been edited by BfB (edited 06-25-2001).]
To quote from the lawyer on that other thread above:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Yes, he should be charged. This is a slam dunk case, and is premised on well established legal theories.
§ 6.04. Causation: Conduct and Results
(a) A person is criminally responsible if the result would not have occurred but for his conduct, operating either alone or concurrently with another cause, unless the concurrent cause was clearly sufficient to produce the result and the conduct of the actor clearly insufficient.
(b) A person is nevertheless criminally responsible for causing a result if the only difference between what actually occurred and what he desired, contemplated, or risked is that:
(1) a different offense was committed; or
(2) a different person or property was injured, harmed, or otherwise affected.
and
§ 6.03. Definitions of Culpable Mental States
(a) A person acts intentionally, or with intent, with respect to the nature of his conduct or to a result of his conduct when it is his
conscious objective or desire to engage in the conduct or cause the result.
(b) A person acts knowingly, or with knowledge, with respect to the nature of his conduct or to circumstances surrounding his
conduct when he is aware of the nature of his conduct or that the circumstances exist. A person acts knowingly, or with knowledge, with
respect to a result of his conduct when he is aware that his conduct is reasonably certain to cause the result.
(c) A person acts recklessly, or is reckless, with respect to circumstances surrounding his conduct or the result of his conduct when he
is aware of but consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk that the circumstances exist or the result will occur. The risk must be of such a nature and degree that its disregard constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care that an ordinary person would exercise under all the circumstances as viewed from the actor's standpoint.
(d) A person acts with criminal negligence, or is criminally negligent, with respect to circumstances surrounding his conduct or the
result of his conduct when he ought to be aware of a substantial and unjustifiable risk that the circumstances exist or the result will
occur. The risk must be of such a nature and degree that the failure to perceive it constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care
that an ordinary person would exercise under all the circumstances as viewed from the actor's standpoint.
Take your pick from C or D above.
And finally:
§ 19.04. Manslaughter
(a) A person commits an offense if he recklessly causes the death of an individual.
(b) An offense under this section is a felony of the second degree.
Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 883, ch. 399, § 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974. Renumbered from § 19.04 by Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 1123, ch. 426, art.
2, § 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974. Amended by Acts 1987, 70th Leg., ch. 307, § 1, eff. Sept. 1, 1987. Renumbered from § 19.05 and amended by
Acts 1993, 73rd Leg., ch. 900, § 1.01, eff. Sept. 1, 1994.
§ 19.05. Criminally Negligent Homicide
(a) A person commits an offense if he causes the death of an individual by criminal negligence.
(b) An offense under this section is a state jail felony.
No question. The prosecutor has a slam dunk case unless one of you speed demons can come up with how drag racing on city streets is neither reckless nor criminally negligent.</font>
§ 6.04. Causation: Conduct and Results
(a) A person is criminally responsible if the result would not have occurred but for his conduct, operating either alone or concurrently with another cause, unless the concurrent cause was clearly sufficient to produce the result and the conduct of the actor clearly insufficient.
(b) A person is nevertheless criminally responsible for causing a result if the only difference between what actually occurred and what he desired, contemplated, or risked is that:
(1) a different offense was committed; or
(2) a different person or property was injured, harmed, or otherwise affected.
and
§ 6.03. Definitions of Culpable Mental States
(a) A person acts intentionally, or with intent, with respect to the nature of his conduct or to a result of his conduct when it is his
conscious objective or desire to engage in the conduct or cause the result.
(b) A person acts knowingly, or with knowledge, with respect to the nature of his conduct or to circumstances surrounding his
conduct when he is aware of the nature of his conduct or that the circumstances exist. A person acts knowingly, or with knowledge, with
respect to a result of his conduct when he is aware that his conduct is reasonably certain to cause the result.
(c) A person acts recklessly, or is reckless, with respect to circumstances surrounding his conduct or the result of his conduct when he
is aware of but consciously disregards a substantial and unjustifiable risk that the circumstances exist or the result will occur. The risk must be of such a nature and degree that its disregard constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care that an ordinary person would exercise under all the circumstances as viewed from the actor's standpoint.
(d) A person acts with criminal negligence, or is criminally negligent, with respect to circumstances surrounding his conduct or the
result of his conduct when he ought to be aware of a substantial and unjustifiable risk that the circumstances exist or the result will
occur. The risk must be of such a nature and degree that the failure to perceive it constitutes a gross deviation from the standard of care
that an ordinary person would exercise under all the circumstances as viewed from the actor's standpoint.
Take your pick from C or D above.
And finally:
§ 19.04. Manslaughter
(a) A person commits an offense if he recklessly causes the death of an individual.
(b) An offense under this section is a felony of the second degree.
Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 883, ch. 399, § 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974. Renumbered from § 19.04 by Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 1123, ch. 426, art.
2, § 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974. Amended by Acts 1987, 70th Leg., ch. 307, § 1, eff. Sept. 1, 1987. Renumbered from § 19.05 and amended by
Acts 1993, 73rd Leg., ch. 900, § 1.01, eff. Sept. 1, 1994.
§ 19.05. Criminally Negligent Homicide
(a) A person commits an offense if he causes the death of an individual by criminal negligence.
(b) An offense under this section is a state jail felony.
No question. The prosecutor has a slam dunk case unless one of you speed demons can come up with how drag racing on city streets is neither reckless nor criminally negligent.</font>
[This message has been edited by BfB (edited 06-25-2001).]
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Acura driver who was racing a red lightning</font>
I know the law is the law (and in this case the Vette driver will pay under the law), but it sucks to have so much riding on something that depends on witnesses' perception. Granted, in this case they were probably racing, but think about it like this:
What if some idiot in a Vette pulls up next to me at a light. He's revving his motor and jumping, but I don't want to race, so when the light turns green I take off normally and he hauls *****. In doing so, he loses control and hits and kills a pedestrian. Shoud I be charged with manslaughter because I was there? Who's to say I wasn't racing...maybe witnesses think my vehicle is just really slow and I'm getting smoked?
Maybe it's just me and maybe I'm paranoid, but like someone on the Corvette board said, "If two high performance vechiles are side by side then they are automatically racing." I'd hate to be put away because of some idiot's penile complex.
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From: Mobile, AL, USA
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by DUCK01:
What if some idiot in a Vette pulls up next to me at a light. He's revving his motor and jumping, but I don't want to race, so when the light turns green I take off normally and he hauls *****. In doing so, he loses control and hits and kills a pedestrian. Shoud I be charged with manslaughter because I was there? Who's to say I wasn't racing...maybe witnesses think my vehicle is just really slow and I'm getting smoked?</font>
What if some idiot in a Vette pulls up next to me at a light. He's revving his motor and jumping, but I don't want to race, so when the light turns green I take off normally and he hauls *****. In doing so, he loses control and hits and kills a pedestrian. Shoud I be charged with manslaughter because I was there? Who's to say I wasn't racing...maybe witnesses think my vehicle is just really slow and I'm getting smoked?</font>
I know what you're doing, you're defending the Corvette driver's idiotic mistakes. You realize that you'll NEVER be in a hypothetical situation as you just described above. You're making up situations that have not a bit of perceiveable clout to anything that happened in the racing scenarios that were previously discussed.
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Maybe it's just me and maybe I'm paranoid, but like someone on the Corvette board said, "If two high performance vechiles are side by side then they are automatically racing." I'd hate to be put away because of some idiot's penile complex.</font>
The fact of the matter is this: He was racing, he committed a crime, he caused death's. PLAIN AND SIMPLE. Do you want my opinion about the "2" charges? No, you don't do you, LoL, but here's my take on it: I feel he should only be charged w/ one count. I'm sure something in a plea will be worked out and he may not even have to serve any time.
BfB
[This message has been edited by BfB (edited 06-25-2001).]
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From: Clifton, NJ, USA
Like I said, 1 charge, for the Volvo driver.
The other driver obviously accepted his risks by racing as well. I'm not saying the law matches this, I'm just saying what I think.
I also do not think he should be able to plea out of it. They killed that Volvo driver and they should bear the burden of the deeds.
Daniel
The other driver obviously accepted his risks by racing as well. I'm not saying the law matches this, I'm just saying what I think.
I also do not think he should be able to plea out of it. They killed that Volvo driver and they should bear the burden of the deeds.
Daniel