This is a picture of UNEQUAL LENGTH shorty's and stock manifolds!

Can you honestly say it doesn't lower combustion temps? Can you honestly say that it doesn't flow better than stock?

Of course the above "discussion" is about EQUAL LENGTH SHORTY HEADERS.
I just posted this to give some example of the camparison

 

Damn, guys. I didn't mean to start a war here. I never figured picking headers would be just a difficult decision. Looks like I'll have to do a little research.

 

And when all your research is done, I feel you'll go with LT's, but thats just a wrench turning nuckle busters opinion, not a Law students.
Good Luck on your research and decision.
Denny

 

Just a law student who's restored a '69 mustang from a rust bucket; replacing body panels, wiring, interior, and engine, suspension etc. Who's bought and modified everycar I've ever had, including a Dodge Avenger with a $10,000 paint job applied by Dupont from Canada, a '83 mustang pulled the 4 banger out and replaced it with a 351cj engine and toploader tranny. a '77 dodge power wagon that I swapped motors in when I was 15 years old! ... awww hell I could go on but I don't need to prove myself.

I guess people here just don't know how to read.
I'm comparing STOCK MANIFOLDS to EQUAL LENGTH SHORTY HEADERS.

I NEVER said shorty's were better than Long tubes. I'm saying one of the major contributors is that a change of catalytic convertors increases the flow of exhaust!

Long tubes are better, but I can't justify their cost. (four times what I paid for my shorty's) With Long tubes, you MUST replace your cats. TO use the stock cats will negate any gains you were expecting.


you'll notice that there are NO comments about shorty's v stock manifolds

 

Ok how about this..

Shorty headers better then stock manifold.

Long Tube headers better then shorty headers.

Shorty headers are cheaper in price then long tubes.

Long Tubes will get better results as HP/TQ increases.

Stock Cats will not bolt up to long tubes.

I have installed Kooks headers and a set of Dynotec headers (2 diff. trucks).

They both have there advantages. As for dyno results have not seen much diff. between the 2 diff. headers.

Have installed shorty headers on other vehicles. Lot easier then long tubes.

In the end its how much do you want to spend?

How loud do you want your truck?

What HP/TQ are you looking for?

Do you plan on mild increase in power or maximum increase in power.

 

LOL, this post is amusing so far.

just another guys take:
it has been posted on this forum that the bassani equal lengths dont make any power, this i believe is tried and true. although they most likely have the ability to cut down the heat and bring down EGT's. they probably will not provide the scavenging a long tube will have, that is where a long tube shines.

also, it is possible to overscavenge as well, so remember this when designing an exhaust. remember folks its about designing a system matched to the motor.

 

I know, sometimes it's just to tempting to ruffle your feathers
No hard feelings, I hope

 

I have know idea about what makes longs better than shorts or shorts better than longs. My question is, why would Bassani put lots of $$$ and time and effort in designing shorties if they don't make power gains? I have there cat-back system and I love it and I think it's about the best one you can buy. Like I said they developed a great cat-back system so I can't see why they would put all that effort in developing something that doesn't have any hp gains. The only thing I can think of is, they developed the shorties to be run with there whole system, not to be pieced together with stock exhaust parts. So if you ran the whole Bassani exhaust system from the headers to the high-flow cats with the mid-pipe, then to the x-piped cat back system would that give you a good gain? I can see where if you put on shorties and keep the stock cats that would cancel out any improvement, where as with long tubes you have to change the cats and therefor get more flow. Like I said before I don't know much about exhaust systems, all I do know is the better you can get your exhaust to flow, the better hp numbers you can get. I have been wanting to get the rest of my exhaust up to speed with my cat-back, but I don't know the best way to go that's why i'm asking these questions. But the one thing I'm positive about is, it's pretty darn confusing that's for sure!

 

If I had to do the exhaust again, here's what I 'd do (In order)

1. Long tubes, Hi Flow cats and a cat back
2. Shorty tubes, Hi Flow Cats and a cat back
3. Stock Manifolds, Hiflow Cats and a cat back
4. Shorty Tubes, Stock Cats, Cat back
5. Stock manifolds, Stock Cats, cat back
6. All Stock.

*you can't run long tubes with stock cats, so that wasn't even considered*

Coincidentally, #1 is most expensive and #6 is cheapest.

rather run stock maifolds and HI flow cats
than
Shorty's and Stock cats.

 

until somebody does a dyno comparisson of two scenarios, this could go on forever. (Same truck, same conditions, same cool down time, etc. of course)

Long tubes, high flow cats, cat back

vs.

Equal length shorty's w/ high flow cats(same size as above), and the same cat back as above.

even measure EGT if you really want to impress us.

Maybe some of the vendors pushing these "refinance-your-house" complete systems could pony up the time and effort to prove how much gain long tubes will actually give us.

why don't we push for this, instead of wasting our time bickering

In the meantime, can anyone put together the average prices of the parts only for the two different scenarios?

 

I bought my hi flow cats used for $100 welded up with baffles (pretty much from the shorty to the cat back)
I bought the shorty's used for $150, I think, maybe it was $100.
I bought the MAC cat back a few years ago for $250'ish New.
I had the muffler shop make new "mid-pipes" with the hi-flow cats and the baffles.

So mine goes through bassani shorty's, through new tubing into the hi-flow cats, into the Exhaust baffles to quiet it down a little, then into the MAC cat back. Overall I like the sound of it. Really low growl

 

here's some quick homework...
(I'm sure somebody can get a better deal on this or that, so by all means post if you think it matters.... this is just what I came up with quick from sites that post prices)


Kooks long tubes and Mid pipes w/ high flow cats $1290

Dynatech long tubes and mid pipes w/ high flow cats $1195

Bassani Shorty equal length coated headers and s.s. mid pipes
w/ high flow cats $1220


feel free to bash the accuracy of the prices... these are from sites we all go, and... I don't care!

 

Im lucky, One of my Ls runs Long tubes no cats and Bassani cat back. Sounds nasty as he!!. Though Im rebuilding the lower end in her right now she will once again cause people to roll up there windows and look at me with disgust! Ah its a beuatiful thing not to have emmisions here in KC!

Bassani makes some of the best quality exhaust systems out there and about the most pricy. Soon ad there R system is available Silver prolly will get one.
Now about installation. The Novice will take quite a bit of time to install either of the two systems. This will save you money but wont get you on the road any time soon, or you can bit the bullet and have a proffesional doit for you for a price be done in an afternoon and have some sort of quality installation quaranty.

Both shorties and Long tubes offer advantages over OE systems and I think its all about what level of performance and compromise are you going to go for.

Oxygen Thief

 

This would be my exact list also. Between the LT's and shorties the LT's should make more torque than the shorties and a bit more power, but the bigger increase would be in the torque due to the tube length advantage.

Jody