Just sent Amsoil the email.

Lets see how long it takes them to respond. I cut and pasted Gregg's explanation on how the soft parts are affected. Also included the problem with warranty, Amsoil's wording which appears to allow them some wiggle room by using the dual purpose fluid when the owners' manual specifically warns not to.

 

Hey Blown,

Was just looking at an old thread. Did you ever get a response from Amsoil?

TB

 

No which is kinda dissappointing considering they pride themself on supposedly being such a stand up company, and on top of that, I am an Amsoil dealer.

 

I use ford synthetic mercon fluid - seems the best bet - still get warrenty and I know its the correct fluid.

 

I'd like to add a little something to this, Amsoil debate.

At 5000 miles on my 01 Lightning, I purchased a FTVB, 4x4 trans pan, 4lb lower, Fast Air intake, plugs and a few other things from Sal. When installing Gregg's valve body, I drained the torque convertor and refilled the trans with Amsoil ATF. After reading where it was bad for my trans, I planned to dump and refill.
Well, its one of those things I never got around to doing. Many hard miles later, it still in there and preforming very well, I guess.
My truck was making 600rwtq before the motor was put in last month. So 13,000 miles later the Amsoil is holding up, or I should say, the trans is holding up.

Now that I've said this, I guess I better start saving for a new Monster Box

 

It's sort of like the intermediate plates and torque reduction, they'll work, until they don't.

I've taken apart transmissions with the seals wrapped 6 times around the piston, but they were apparently still holding, I've also taken some apart that have just a little 'stretch' in them that were the root cause failure. Sometimes, you get lucky, sometimes you don't.

G

 

Still beating this old dog but I wasn't satisfied, so I thought that I should push this one to the limit. After all, I have Amsoil ATF in my transmission. I love my truck and if I did something that isn't right then I should correct it now before damage is done.

What I did:

1-Called up Amsoil technical and got the reps e-mail address. Fired him a message with most of the comments received from this board.

2-The Amsoil Tech (Brian) called me back and told me he would escalate the issue to the top technical manager (Kevin)

3-Kevin received my information just as he was stepping into a meeting with Amsoil's chief chemist and the President and CEO's (Al Amatuzio) son. That's really as high as you can go at Amsoil.

4-Kevin (tech manager) called me back directly to discuss the issue. I asked him to reply to me in writing and asked him permission to post his reply. He agreed.

The Amsoil employees addressed my concerns with a high level of professionalism. I can't ask for anything more.

This is my initial e-mail to Brian:

Hi Brian,
> > Prior to putting Amsoil ATF in my transmission, I contacted your office to ensure that your
product was compatible. A Ford Motor Company Corporate employee has commented that your
product is not compatible with the 4R100 Transmission. I'm not trying to find fault anywhere.
I just want to make sure I have the right product in my transmission. His comments are from him
below:
> >
> > "HFM means Highly Friction Modified, an industry term for a class of fluids
> > that contain a certain set of additives. These additives are not compatible
> > with internal components of the 4R100/E4OD.
> >
> > HFM chemical additives are not compatible with the seals in the forward clutch, the seals
in the Low Reverse piston, the bonded seals in the overdrive apply and intermediate apply
piston and not compatible with the friction material in the forward clutch. Use of highly
friction modified additives will cause softening and stretching of the seals and lamination of
the frictin material on clutch plates resulting in the failure of the transmission.
> >
> > If you read the very fine print of the waranty on amsoils website, you'll see the warranty
doesn't cover it if you use a fluid not compatible with the manufacturers reccomendations, and
if you look at your owners manual, it says in great big bold print, quotated and all, not to
use dual usage fluids.
> >
> > As you can see, Amsoil ATF fluid falls under the category of dual purpose when it comes to
Mercon (regular and Mercon V). The Amsoil ATF with HFM additives will have negative effects on
soft parts such as seals.
> >
> > Amsoil say this on their web site
> >
> > THE WARRANTY MAY NOT BE EXTENDED TO COVER:
> > 1. AMSOIL lubricants used in mechanically deficient equipment as a result of abnormal
operation; negligence; abuse; damage from casualty, shipment or accident; or equipment
modification done without written authorization from the OEM.
> > 2. AMSOIL lubricants that have been used for the purposes of racing or in applications
where the OEM required lubricant standards do not match those stated by AMSOIL INC. without the
written approval from AMSOIL INC.
> >
> >
> > So based on those two lines alone, it won't cover it because the OEM (Ford) says very
specifically not to use a dual usage fluid in the 4R100, in your owners manual, and it seems to
me they have enough wiggle room that if you have any mods at all, they can get out of it that
way, unless Ford gives you written permission to mod it (good luck on that one)"
> >
> > "There is a AMSOIL product (Torque Drive ATD) that is MERCON compatilbe and not dual usage,
which at least is the right fluid, but I've said many times, aside from holding heat better,
which any synthetic will do, I don't think any fluid is gonna give you any better
performance."
> >
> >
> > Thank you very much Brian. I can be reached at (xxx) xxx-xxxx
> >

 

This is Amsoil's reply which was sent from the technical manager to the technical rep and then forwarded to me:

From: Dinwiddie, Kevin

> > To: Kershaw, Bryan
> > Subject: RE: Amsoil ATF compatibility to 4R100 transmission in a 2000-2004
> > F150 SVT Lightning
> >
> >
> > Bryan,
> >
> > I've done some investigation regarding our Synthetic ATF and the Ford Motor Company
Corporate employee seal incompatible comments. First of all I would like to say we have
performed all of our seal testing specific to the Ford specifications and have are well within
the Ford requirements. The AMSOIL ATF also meets the friction requirements for use in the Ford
4R100/E40D transmission, therefore, AMSOIL ATF is totally compatible with the seals and
materials in the Ford 4R100/E40D transmission and will not cause the problems stated by the
Ford employee.
> >
> > According to our sources, there was a MERCON V fluid that Ford tested early on from another
oil company which was not compatible with MERCON. This is why Ford stated not to use dual
service MERCON/MERCON V fluids. The Ford statement does not apply to modern fluids such as
AMSOIL ATF which has the technology to meet both MERCON and MERCON V specifications.
> >
> > Bryan, please see that Mr. xxxx gets this information.
> >
> > Sincerely,
> >
> > Kevin Dinwiddie
> > STLE/CLS
> > Technical Products Mgr.
> > Drivetrain & Power Transmissions
> > AMSOIL Inc.
> > AMSOIL Building
> > Superior, WI. 54880
> > Phone: 715-392-7101 ex. 275
> > Fax: 715-392-3097
> > Email kdinwiddie@amsoil.com
> >

 

I did discuss with Kevin the differences between Torque-Drive and Amsoil's ATF and the bottom line is that the ATF is the RIGHT fluid for our trucks.

Well, fellow members, I'm done. This is one issue that kept coming back and wasn't answered to my satisfaction. I can sleep more soundly now that I know that I'm not damaging anything in my transmission and that if there is an issue with warranty it will be covered by Ford and if not Amsoil will stand behind their product. I would also like to note that this is the beginning of the third season with Amsoil in my tranny which now has over 55K and well over 20 track days on the road course. It sure looks like Amsoil's ATF is doing its job.

PS. I don't sell the stuff, I just use it. This information is intended for information purposed only to the F150online members and not intended to promote the use of the fluid.

 

so what type of tranny fluid did the Lightning come with stock? I'm all confused now!

 

Should be Dexron III/Mercon

 

Mark, mercon and not five. just a quckie from an oxygen thief!

 

I put the the Amsoil Torque Drive fluid in since its specifications state that it's not a dual usage fluid. I'm glad to find out that the more readily available ATF they have is just fine. I've used their ATF in my 93 F150 and that tranny lasted (way) beyond the typical 100k mileage mark where the early 90's Ford transmissions would typically crap out.

The long lasting resistance to break down is what makes synthetic tranny fluid such a worthwhile expense.

 

Blown,
The tech did mention that Torque Drive could be used without any issues but that ATF is the higher performing fluid for our transmissions.

TB

 

I just picked up two cases of Mercon/Dexron III from my local Ford dealer. $1.98 a quart. Didn't think to get synthetic. Do they sell a synthetic version of Mercon that I should get. Is it worth it. Tranny has 59k on it.