OK, so I don't still have a Lightning but I did and I am trying to make my Wood as good as she can be.

Regarding an earlier thread dealing with Lightnings vs BMW, I had a good run with a 4 door automatic 330I this afternoon on the way home from the store. Starting from a red light, no traffic, temp was 88 degrees, no wind etc.

I have no idea what a garden variety 330I is capable of and this one was bone stock I am sure. I know a stock Wood does the 1/4 in about 16.2 and mine has chip/filter/exhaust and is, in my opinion, very strong. Have not had it to the track nor on a dyno.

In any case, we went head to head and we were dead even up to 60 mph more or less when he just quit. I am curious if the torque of the 5.4 motor, even though the 32 valve Gator motor comes up on the cams a bit late in the game, is enough to stay with what is obviously a very much more sophisticated almost racing motor in a sedan. I know many of you drive such cars and I would like your input.

On a side note, I work my store on the weekends till about 6:00 and as such cannot drive to the nearest 1/4 mile track which is about 2 hours away. I can get to a 1/8 mile track on Saturdays which is only about 20 minutes away. Is there a reliable formula to extrapolate what your 1/4 mile time/mph might be based on what you get in a 1/8 mile run????

Bill

 

In a 1/4 mile, I think the Bimmer will pull on you pretty good. The 330 is at least 1 second quicker than 16.2....

 

Understood, and I am not sure it was a fair go.
I guess what I am asking is can a Wood that does what it does in the 1/4 mile stay with a BMW 330I up to 60 mph?

Given the mods I have on the Wood, I think it is possible that I have gone from 300HP to maybe more or less 350HP at best, maybe more like 340 or so.

Best case scenario is that my Wood may do somewhere in the vicinity of maybe 15.6 to 15.8 in the 1/4 mile. Still, is it possible that a 5.4 litre mod motor can generate enough off the line power to beat something like the Bimmer up to 60 MPH????

Damn, it is a bit late and I am asking the same question twice I guess.

In any case, we ended up even whether or not the BMW guy was really trying or not.

Bill

 

Bill,

According to the stats found in the cool 0-60 website (http://www.car-stats.com/stats/search/choosemake.aspx), a stock Wood runs 0-60 in 8.1 seconds and does the 1/4 in 16.2 @ 86 mph.

The same website shows a 530iA (automatic trans and a little heavier than a 330iA) at 6.7 for the 0-60 run and 15.3 in the 1/4 @ 93 mph.

I used the 530iA data because the above website does not show an automatic trans 330i and I'm pretty sure the one you raced was an auto. Interestingly enough, C&D tested an '03 330iA and recorded a 0-60 time of 7.3 and a quarter mile time of 15.4 -- both of which are slower than the above 530iA times! Just goes to show you how different drivers, track conditions and weather can affect times.

Regards,

Mike Philpott

 

Thanks, guys:

Based on those numbers, I might be in the ballpark to stay with such a vehicle. I realize I have no dyno graphs nor time slips so I'm not about to claim anything as a positive, but......... I have had a couple of vehicles recently with chip/filter/exhaust and as all know on the board, they can help a lot. If we assume I picked up 10% in power and had a resulting increase in performance I would be in their ballpark in theory.
I have a flipchip in the wood with an aggressive and an aggressiver (new word) programs. If I picked up 50 honest hp instead of 30 that would be about 16% (probably a bit optimistic) and that would again in theory put me in the high 13s.
(Note here that I just now did the math and my earlier 15.8 projection would only be a 3% improvement which may be to conservative).

Anyway, it was what it was and I guess I will just have to suck it up and make that long trek to Commerce Ga. and get a time slip or two or go to the local dyno shop and get a graph or two.

Thanks again for your interest. It would be cool if a Wood could do in the high 13s with under $1K in mods. I know it sure feels strong and will chirp the tires in second and impresses the heck out of all who have ridden in it. Even if it only got in the 14s that is still pretty quick.
Bill

 

Get a blower!!

 

cyntaxx:

Don't think I haven't thought a lot about that.

One issue is cost ~$5K to do it right and the another is "dare I say it" warranty which on the Gator motor can be more than a bit of a bother. I know all too well the play and pay scenario. As well, the trannie could be an issue as it is a "luxo" tuned version of the standard Gator.
Sort of off topic, but I really do wish that FMC would get with the program in the sense that Toyota/MB/BMW and a few other manufacturers do where they let the dealers install/upgrade or whatever their products and offer a full warranty and it is understood that the limits of the engine/tranny will not be exceeded. I know you fairly well through our friendly f150online and I know there are those who wish to push the envelope quite a bit and I love reading about 9-10-11-12 second L's.
This is not really my bag, I am looking for just getting the built in performance potential of my 32 valver in the same sense that I wanted to get the potential out of my '99 Lightning.

Not to open yet another can of worms on the subject of chips vs reburns, but obviously FMC used the reburn route to get 380 hp out of the current L motor vs the original 360 and I would assume went the same route to detune the HD to 340 hp. OOPS, different pulley as I remember now.

My personal opinion now having put 15K miles on my Wood is that the 32 valve 5.4 has a great deal of unrealized potential.
Some of that can be regained by normal add ons such as I have done.

To return to your suggestion, there are a couple of aftermarket blowers that I could buy that would give me 100 hp~ but I would really rather have a factory approved application if that were possible. I looked at a complete Cobra set up but it was more or less all hp and no torque and that would not work real good with 5700 lbs to haul around.

Sorry to spend so much time on the Lightning section talking about a Blackwood but I do enjoy you folks so much.

 

If you only want to beat him to 60mph.

The easiest way is to put some 4.11 or 4.56 gears in the rear end and you will definetly take him up to 60mph.

 

Bill,

Your Blackwood weighs 5,700 pounds? Wow! You're right about torque then. It would be at least as important as raw horsepower.

Have you modified the exhaust system? A rumbly (but not loud) Wood would be pretty cool.

Mike

 

Mike & I-menace:

Gears is a good possibility as the OD trannie really knocks down the rpm at cruise and it shoudn't be screaming at 75-80 on the highway.

My exhaust is a single Magnaflow single inlet dual outlet with "dual" dual tips. The decision to go this route was after a lot of discussion on various boards/emails etc. about the torque characteristics of the 32 valve motor. The Wood doesn't really start moving real good until it gets "up on the cams" as the racers say. Power starts to be felt at about 2800 rpm and stays strong to redline. Were I to have a really free flowing exhaust, I was told I would lose a fair amount of torque on the bottom end and hauling 5700 lbs that would defeat the purpose. I need back pressure sort of the same way a Lightning does. Cobras get away with it because of their lighter weight I am told.

As to sound, it is awesome. Very low and very mellow not blatty at all. You can hear it in the cab but it is not obtrusive at cruise but definitely there when on the loud pedal.

If I keep it when it comes off lease, I may end up doing the blower thingie as it will be out of warranty anyhow.

Finally, in the cold hard light of the day, I realize my projected numbers of last night are not realistic. Somewhere I have a road test of a Paxton blown Wood with chip/filter as well that got into the mid 14s I think. Something about those 5700 lbs I guess. So I might be back to somewhere in the mid 15s as it is set up now.
Bill

 

not being an *** here but i doubt you got more than 20 HP with a chip, filter, and muffler.

 

was in shock when he saw the vehicle and the gray haired gentleman smoking the cigarette--smokin' him, Ha! To refresh your memory, I'm the guy in the red 00L who met you at your store and you took me for ride in Moby so I could hear the Bassani! Well being a procrastinator paid off for a change! Just recently put on the new Magnaflow catback and love the sound for 1/2 price of Bassani. Bill don't scare those cobb folks too much!

 

eatoncharged:

No offense taken and you could well be correct. Sadly, I did not do a baseline dyno so I guess I will never know but I am now interested enough to get the present numbers that I will get it dynoed soon as it is set up.

While I am talking apples and oranges here, I did pick up about 28 horsepower on my 99 L going from bone stock to just a Superchip. I also later installed a Bassani full meal system and a PSP filter setup. Never did dyno that combo but it was a very strong truck.

Since I am already here tonight, let me throw a couple more theories at ya. Firstly, while I am no mechanical wizard I do a lot of research on my vehicles like most on these types of boards.
I have had 5 or 6 different chips, for example, and have talked to each of the chip burners about the Ford Modular Motor. I had the L, two 4.6 DOHC Conti's (wifemobiles) the Wood 5.4 DOHC and the 92 TC 4.6 SOHC

I try to be extremely careful about putting words in anyone else's mouth, especially tuners, but I certainly got a sense of the following.

I believe that most of the tuners feel that Ford has set up the PCM programs for most of their vehicles in an extremely conservative state of tune. Moreso, perhaps, than other manufacturers. If my reading of their input is correct, then it is entirely possible that they can get rather a lot of increase in power with a properly programmed chip. In other words, the Modular Motor may be so detuned in stock form that we may see more improvement than some other brands with, for instance, a chip (street chip in this case).

I have also read on many FMC type boards that the stock intake system (air filter) is a real bottleneck on the Modular Motor family no matter which vehicle we are considering and that anything we do to improve on the stock system pays rather big dividends.

On the exhaust side, I only know a bit about the Lightnings and not much at that. I spent $1300 on my system and saw little improvement in performance, just better sound and it may be that they got that part right from the get go.

So, you may be right but I think the possibility exists that these motors may get more out of the chip/filter/exhaust combo than we think. Not arguing, just theorizing.

JakeMarietta:

Good to hear from you, drop by and I will let you drive the Wood and you can post your opinion

Got a better story for today. Going home, got onto Dallas Hwy (120) and caught a light behind a late model Vette convert with automatic. He took off medium quick and I floored the Wood. Mind you, he was not going full chat but quite fast off the line. Course, the wood will not spin the wheels so there was no drama on my part. I have no idea how far the Vette guy was into the throttle ( think a regular motor convert with auto is about what a 6.5 to 7.0 second 0-60 car versus my 8.something?)
Anyway, we toodle off and I am right on his **** (safely of course) and he keeps checking his six and I am still there. 30-45-55-65 mph. Finally, he actually turned his head to make sure this ugly black and stainless steel barn door is still on his butt. At that point, he floored it and pulled me a fair bit.

The satisfaction factor was maximum

BTW, with the combo I have when I get on the cams it feels almost like a 1.5 lb burst of NOS

Bill

 

those trucks are sick as **** anyway. that was one of the things i was going to get b4 the harley but they only made like 2000 or something.
hard to say what you saw as in increase but if they are 300fwhp and you see a 15% loss that means your right at 255 rwhp so realistically i think you gained yourself about 15 rwhp with that setup.
JMO i could be wrong those are just numbers you know.
personally i wouldnt supercharge it because theres no one that really builds those motors up that i know of if you did blow it, and youd more than likely be screwed as far as a tranny.

 

to replace that "little old lady from Pasadena"! Ha ha! Will take you up on your offer to drive the "wood" sometime. Nickname for it yet--like Moby? "Woody" might be too obvious with overtones? Believe all current, non Z06's are 350hp (at crank, of course)