Does anyone offer a Turbo set for Gen 2's yet? I've looked everywhere and I can't find any info on it. Surely after almost 4 years on the market, SOMEONE has decided to go Turbo and make some real power in these trucks. I thought I heard that Silver State Motorsports was working on something a while back...but I couldn't find the info.

With the sick torque that a Turbo makes in the lower rpms, I would think that it would be a perfect match for these 4500 lb. whales. Not to mention getting rid of the ridiculous amount of parasitic drag that screw-type blowers offer.


Even a small 60-1 Hifi could easily make 475-500 hp with barely more than stock boost levels.

Any info would be appreciated.

 

I'm pretty sure that Mike @ silverstate has done a Turbo gen II L. Call the or http://www.silverstatemotorsports.com/

 

Why?

Last I checked turbo's aren't know for "sick torque" as you put it.

I could be wrong, but you'd have to go twin-turbo to get any decent low end.

Superchargers take HP to spin, but so do turbos. Super chargers just express it differently (straight to the crank vs. backed-up exhaust/intake temp).

Doing some quick napkin math: Our stock 5.4 minus the charger should be around 290hp.

To get 500hp out of that (at the crank) you'd need to be running around 10psi of magically delicious turbo goodness (perfectly efficient turbo and intercooler). Assuming 14% drivetrain loss, you'd be at 430hp to the wheels.

Which is what I've got with.... wait for it... wait for it... 10 psi of boost.

Would a twin-turbo setup be easier than all of my mods? maybe. but what's the point? a SC (especially a screw charger) generates gobs of stump pulling torque which is what this truck needs. They just fit well together.

Coldie

 

You're kidding right? Ever wonder why Tractor trailers use Turbos?? Perhaps you haven't "checked" the right places. Talk to any serious Turbo racer/tuner and all you'll hear about is the amazing Tq produced by a turbo A buddy of mine runs a PT-74 on his 5.0 (not a stroker, just a lil' 302)....He made 740 lb ft of RWtq @ 3800 rpms. Granted, this was w/ 18 psi, but with less boost (14 psi), he made 586 RWtq. I know everyone has different definitions of "sick torque"...but IMO, 740 ft lbs is pretty "sick". BTW....he was at 400 Rwtq when the dyno pull began to register @ 2200 rpms. I think those #'s are more than enuff to get an L' rolling. Granted this is just one example...but I can find countless others if you prefer.


See above example...that was with a single.

A Roots-style s/c (like ours) will easily eat 50 hp just to turn it. Just by switching to a Turbo you would free up 50 hp. That's "free" power. That's how a small displacement turbo can make substantially more HP w/ the same boost levels. Not only that but, there are numerous other advantages. With a Turbo you don't have to worry about belt slippage or crank bearing wear. You can completely control the amount of boost with the turn of a ****. Depending on the Turbo size, you can see full boost as early as 2700 rpms.

That's a blanket statement. Let me ask you....Is the Hp level with 10 psi from the stock blower the same as the Hp level with 10 psi from the Kenne Bell. Hint: No. The Kenne Bell makes much more power at the same boost level. This is also true w/ Turbos. 10 psi out of a 60-1 hifi isn't the same as 10 psi from a T-76. Blower/Turbo displacement is huge part of the equation. Another Example: A stock Supra can run 19 psi w/ stock twins and make about 430-440 rwhp....however, if you drop the twins, install a big single (T-76) and run the same 19 psi....you'll have a MONSTER, making gobs more power.


I'm glad that you are happy w/ your setup...it sounds like a good one. I, on the other hand, don't want to follow the masses. I don't want to go to the track or a car show and see yet ANOTHER s/c'd Gen II L'. I don't function that way. Perhaps my brain is broken, but I want to try something different. What if Ford said..."A supercharged Truck? Why bother....what's the point? A supercharger belongs on a car....they just fit well together." .....Where would we be? What if GN owners said....It's only a 6 cylinder...why bother trying to modify it? What's the point?

Besides that, I've seen again and again, the power that a Turbo can make over a parasitic, hp sucking, S/C'r.

Everytime I see STREET DRIVEN, 6 cyl Supra trap at 140+, or everytime I see a tiny little 2.0L 4 cylinder import run an 8.xx....It solidifies my opinion that Turbos are supremely more effective and more efficient than S/C'rs.


Redneck-
Thanks for the link

 

I wouldn't call a turbo supreme over a blower,,,, but you are right there, just look at Semi Trucks with their "turbo diesle" ,,, but I will say this,, you definately OWNED on that reply.

~Toast

 

t/cing an L is good idea, id say shoot for it, have you seen the 1000hp harley truck? well 750 straight motor anways(250shot of nitrous)...the only thing id be worried about is lag, also arent turbos more expensive? and i believe magnuson says that it only takes about 5hp to run a 112 i believe (i think i remember seeing that on the magnacharger website?)

just for *****s and giggles, a top fuel dragster with a 54psi blower takes on average 405hp to run it (thats a z06 motor alone!!!) and roughly 30hp per fuel pump (i think theres 2?) and run on the verge of hydraulic lock (no wonder these things grenade so much) and crank out some where around 7000hp estimated (i guess theres not a dyno that could take it). just curious but howcome top fuelers dont use turbos?

 

Geee, where is gigi, when you need it?

But seriously, I would love to see a turbo Gen2, and a twin-turbo Gen 2 would give me a woody......

Pic enclosed of a Gen1 for your viewing pleasure

 

My thoughts exactly. Turbos completely leave my mind when I see a 300+ mph trap speed on a S/C motor To each his own though, there is no superior way to do it.

 

Turbo lag on an automatic car/truck is MUCH different than turbo lag on a stick car/truck. With the right effeciency and trim, you'd never notice a lag, IMHO.

As far as single vs. twins go - it's an age old argument. I chose single for my Mustang due to decreased maintenance, no need for gobs of torque at the 1500rpm-2000rpm range (really where the twins are most beneficial), and need/want for upper RPM capability.

I've got 14psi at 2300rpms with a T64. A buddy's got twin T04e's and sees full boost by 1900-2000rpms.

I'd love to drive one of our trucks with a turbo, but in my opinion, the roots/screw SC on our trucks are a much more simple (and cost effective) approach.

'Course, it sure would be nice to be able to turn a screw underhood to adjust boost, instead of swapping pulleys

 

There's a couple of things that are wrong in the thread. First, turbo's do take power to turn. You can't "see" it the same way you can with a blower, but its there. The higher backpressure in the exhaust manifold makes it harder for the pistion to reach TDC on the exhuast stroke, taking power. I will agree that the turbo is more efficient than the blowers and will make for power at the same boost levels, but it is definately not FREE power.

Also, turbo's are not known for torque in the engine speed ranges where you would like it with a big heavy truck with an automatic tranny. The turbo's make "sick" torque but only after they have spooled. To spool the turbo you have to be at the right speed (at least 2000 - 2500 rpm, not much boost available below that with a properly sized turbo) and then you have to punch on the go pedal and wait some amount of time. While that time is fairly small with the newer better turbo's, it is still time. The blowers we have have instant boost even before the pedal goes past half way. That's a big plus on a heavy vehicle.

Diesel turbo's are very different that gasoline turbo's, and it has to do with how the engine operates. A diesel makes power according to how much fuel you dump in (not related to air). The limit is when it smokes as the particulate emissions become too high. So there really is no lag. You want a new amount of power, just put in more fuel. Eventually the airflow catches up and the smoke goes away.

On a gasoline engine, the fuel is injected in propertion to the airflow. So you have to wait on the airflow before you recieve the fuel, hence the lag.

I'll agree that if you are a dyno ***** or a track *****, then you can definately get more peak power and probably a better 1/4 mile time with a turbo. But when your cruisin' in O/D and that little ricer try's a flyby and you need power immediately, I'll take a Works 140 of KB anyday.

 

FYI, there is no such thing as "free power", it takes power to spin the turbo, and that power comes from the motor's exhaust, so you are eating HP as well ...

 

I'm not going to get into the turbo vs blower debate, but I'd like to comment on the "tractors trailers use turbos" comment. Diesels don't use turbos to make torque. Turbos are used on diesels to lower EGTs. Diesels make tons of torque with high compression and tons of fuel. But as you add fuel, EGTs go way up. Turbos are used to force more air in with the fuel to lower EGTs back to safe levels. If youre EGTs are too high, just give it more boost. Think of a turbo on a diesel as a powercooler on a Lightning.

 

It's been done. Race Related in Clearwater, FL is sporting a 1000hp, 1100tq Turbo Charged 02' Harley Truck. 800hp is the motor & turbo, 200hp is nitrous.

Do a search on F L A S V T and you'll find a link to pictures of it.

 

turbos are cool, or something..




so are twin superchargers..

 

I'm to much of an idiot to get a correctly quoted reply, so bear with me

Turbo Diesels: have been covered by lightning tuner. I'll just sum it up that diesel != gas != nitro

Your example of sick torque proves my point. at 2200 rpm he's got 400 ft lbs of torque, at 3800 rpm almost twice that.

Look at most every dyno posted for our trucks, virtually flat torque curve from whever the torque converter locks up to whenever the fuel gives up.

You also say you can get full boost "as early as 2700 rpm". Full boost in a SC is immediate. Theoretically speaking, you have full boost at 1rpm.

I agree that either SC, turbo or nitrous (OK NAWWWZ!) can be used to produce huge amounts of power. I just think that a SC in most cases will most easily produce the large flat torque curve that is required to get our trucks moving.

One last thing: I think a reason you don't see big SC's on small cars is simply a matter of weight and size. The "SC sticking out of the hood" look isn't really in in the import crowd

PS: I'm not an anti-turbo **** or anything. If you want to do it, go for it. my other race car is a Saturn SC2, so trust me when I say I'm not against being unique. Just pointing out the advantages of a SC.

Coldie