http://www.europac.net/externalframe...95&type=schiff

Government intervention, not health insurance companies, are the reason for high health care costs. Or as Peter Schiff says, "Government breaks your leg, hands you a pair of crutches, then says "See! You couldn't walk without me!"

 

I know a gut, that worked for a local car dealership as Shop Foreman for 20 years. He paid his insurance premiums, deducted out of his check for the duration of the time he worked for this company.

He than started showing signs of MS. Keep in mind for 20+ years he paid insurance. But when he became a drain on the insurance company, they raised the rates for the entire dealership. The owner of the dealership had to let him go or lose insurance for the rest of the employees that worked there.

You are defending these parasites. I'm sure over the course of his healthy life they collected and invested enough in other areas to cover the loss they were now incurring because of his condition. But the bloodsuckers simply cut him off.

I don't think this Health Care Reform Bill is the right way to go, as a matter of fact I don't even know what it entails. But insurance companies love to take your money, but do not like to pay for your coverage.

I also have examples from personal experience. If you care to here them.

Something does need to be done to regulate health insurance. But I do not believe anyone should get something for nothing

 

Welcome to the new, "fundamentally changed" America

 

I'm not going to pretend I know much about this subject, because I don't. But I do feel this guy got the shaft from the insurance company.

 

Tumba - Oh definately I agree. That guy shouldn't have been dropped and the insurance company shouldn't have been allowed to try and extort the business for more money because an employee got sick and needed care.

Reform is needed, I just don't think this bill is the best it can be by a long shot.

 

It's all checks and balances.
A very carefully choreographed dance between Govt. and industry is the best for consumers. Let the insurance industry have free reins and it will escalate until they've squeezed every available penny of profit out of the consumer. Let the Govt. run it and it will become an unmanageable agency that will escalate until they've squeezed every available dollar out of the taxpayer.

 

Good point! This is how health insurance companies shot themselves in the foot, and now rather than straighten out their act, they want to blame government intervention. Government intervention is happening because of their not taking responsibility, and for years of mismanagement of the health care business. Who wants a health care system that is only interested in taking care of the healthy and abandoning those who suffer an illness? Did these health insurance companies think they could go on indefinitely handling responsible people in an irresponsible way and not have it cause a problem?

I've heard of the same problem in the life insurance industry. People get cancer and can no longer work, but when they leave their job they are asked to sign paperwork that effectively ends their policy and starts a new one, which denies payment if they die of cancer because that is now a pre-existing condition. I have a friend going through this who has been very responsible in managing all insurance issues for many years.

 

Y'all do realize the health insurance industry only operates at an average of 8% profit don't you? That means in order for the companies to remain profitable they must increase premiums when their costs increase. The bigger the policy base the less influence one person getting sick has.

In the case of the worker at the auto dealership, if the laws were changed to allow for interstate competition, how difficult would it be for, say Ford, to allow it's dealerships to buy into their health insurance at no cost to Ford? That would have the effect of lowering the costs of the policies for everyone buying them. It would also lower the influence one person getting sick at a dealership would have on the price of insurance at that dealership, since the base is so large.

When will people realize its not the insurance companies, its the cost of health care. The bill in Congress does nothing to address the cost of health care, it only addresses health insurance.

 

Numbers can be made to show many different things. Do you think there may be padding in those numbers, plus and unlimited number of Vice Presidents and other over paid executive in that factor.

I forgot to mention, The insurance companies and the executives also own businesses that provide services to the patients.

 

From 3.3 % average profit margin to a 400+% increase by major health insurers in the past couple of years.

http://blog.aflcio.org/2009/05/27/he...near-monopoly/

http://mjperry.blogspot.com/2009/10/...ank-86-by.html

http://www.debate.org/debates/Health...in-the-U.S./1/


You can find what you want to find to substantiate your claims.

My indicator:

I watch where my local insurance guys live, eat, vacation and invest. They are all making lots more than most people in my neighborhood. Spending patterns don't lie. The profits are hidden somewhere in the published bottom line. There are no poor insurance agents, especially the ones associated with larger nationwide or worldwide companies.
Now if the locals are making those kinds of bucks, what are the corporate guys rakin' in?
Yeah, I'm believing there's a very low profit margin on insurance..... I also believe I'll grow a skinny sixth finger on my left hand just for pickin' my nose.
My best buddy of 30 years or more is a local insurance agency owner. He's always telling us that auto insurance is a loss leader for their other lines. They don't make money on auto insurance, but they have to sell it to get in the door with home, life and health policies. It's his story and he's sticking to it!

 

Actually we have two problems because they both are to blame, and neither will accept responsibility and fix their end of the problem, and left alone the will continue to point fingers as the problem worsens until maybe some day the government will have to bail them both out.

I don't think anybody has a clue. We hear a lot of concerns of waiting in lines for inferior health care and doctors who find their career less profitable, but that does not 'address the cost of health care?'

 

i don't necessarily disagree, or agree with anything here...
of course there are problems. and of course, there's lots of blame to go around.
BUT,
First, how on earth can anyone who lives here claim anything here is unregulated? What is unregulated? Please name one thing we do that is free of government intervention.
Second, why would anyone believe that the people that brought us the DMV, the post office, the Hurricane Katrina response, one financial crisis after the other, etc., etc., etc, can fix or improve anything they touch?
and finally, don't forget, everything government does, for good or bad, effective or not, right or wrong, is done at the point of a gun. Try breaking the law sometime - they don't send the boy scouts to write speeding tickets. is this really how you want to treat your headache, or your cancer, or your old age?

it seems to me we are missing the point. first, refusing to pay costs, or making somebody else pay those costs, does not reduce those costs. second, we are not talking about how to improve health care. we are talking about who gets to decide how to improve health care. is it going to be me and my doctor, or somebody paid with money taken forcefully from me who doesn't know me, can't get a better job, and gets nothing or loses nothing regardless of how happy i am or am not with his decisions.

how is this better than today?

 

I don't mean to be a jerk, and I certainly don't know your friend or his life insurance coverage, but based on benefits I've had from all of my employers over the years, if you're relying on employer-provided life insurance, you're not doing a good job of managing your life insurance.

 

Well said. Very little isn't regulated in some fashion by the government. The insurance industry isn't without sin, no doubt. But socialized medical care is going to be a bite that we can't chew.

The worst part is going to be when this monster is fully implemented (in January 2014 last I heard) and the dollar is further shunned by the world. Only then will we see the true costs of this. And most economists outside the clutches of the government say it's not going to be pretty.

 

Maybe we would be better off if health care was regulated like the phone companies used to be. Did you have a problem with how your phone worked or was billed back then?

I think it's a horse a piece. No one can be refused for emergency health care today, and we all pay for that. For those who have health insurance and need more care, we all pay for that.


Right now my doctor complains because my health insurance determines which prescription he give me based on what they will cover. He thinks he should be deciding. Still, the cost is excessive. We can hardly afford the health care we have now, and some can't afford the health care we have now. Is it more important to improve health care or to afford people health care currently available?