Here's a lot of info on where some of the weather stations are http://www.norcalblogs.com/watts/weather_stations/

 

Classic!

Even though the data is skewed, the nut jobs still want us to cripple our economy, just in case we are causing global warming.

Besides it being a 'religion' to some, I think there are other aspects to the global warming charade.

Let's follow the money:

1) Placing costly environmental restrictions on US companies places us at a disadvantage, allowing other countries to catch and surpass us in economic strength. Much of the world (including many US citizens and politicians) actually do desire this outcome. If they can convince the dupes that the world is being saved, they will be granted more power to acheive their goals quickly.

2) The rules and regulations create new commodities, such as carbon credits. There are fortunes to be made in these commodities. Companies that pollute (basically, any company who makes anything) will be forced to buy 'carbon credits' from landowners that don't pollute, in exchange for the land-owner agreeing to never develop his land. This restricts the future potential of the US economy (see #1). Also, who owns lots of land? Anyone? Bueller? That's right, the US Government! If global warming/climate change is no longer a threat, the US Govt. and large private land owners (Ted Turner? George Soros?) will lose the opportunity to extort carbon credit dollars from the productive elements of our economy.

 

Man being responsible for global warming is a joke. I actually laugh when peole bring it up. Water vapor accounts for the vast majority of greenhouse gases. What do you want to do get rid of it? Stupid water!!! I hate you!!

 

Look, the average temperatures have Warmed over the last 140 years. That's a Fact.

The cause of this warming is a Separate Debate. Again, the fact is the earth is warming.

Yes, a Billion years ago the earth was covered in a layer of molten Magma, so I guess the earth has "Cooled" since then... What's that have to do with anything?

 

It means that the Earth goes through its own climate changes and there is nothing we can do about it! It also means the sky is falling!

 

Normally it takes something to fall from the sky to cause such a Sudden/Dramatic increase in climate temperatures..

Which leads to the reason being contributed to Man.

You guys should go to China sometime and see what Man is doing to the Environment there... I have. Mankind effecting the Climate doesn't seem like that much of a stretch to me.... And the US puts out just as much!

 

Ok it's one think to say that we need to make changes so we don't pollute as much. I think we can all agree that less pollution will only be a good thing.

But creating a fear and panic that says we need to do this in 5 years(or whatever) is just stupid.

It will cost too much, it will be done the wrong way, and it will put the US at a MAJOR economical disadvantage to other countries company's that don't give a crap.

So then the crappy/unsafe junk that we already buy from China will become even cheaper compared to US built products, we will buy even more from them, they will become even more powerfull, and the US will turn into Canada or some other, mediocre country without much influence.

If the Climate Change politicians were serious about "change" they would ban all trade to and from CHINA.

 

What i find funny is that they use a station ontop of the Mauna Loa volcano in Hawaii to get the CO2 readings for the atmosphere, and claim the data says the amount of CO2 is rising immensely. Volcanos produces TONS of CO2.

 

The Sence of Urgency comes from:

1, the Rapid change in climate we've experienced over the last 150 years

2, the projected Increases in Polution and Green house Gasses we're currently on track to see over the next 10 years.


I agree, this should all be on the Shoulders of the US. China is developing (growing) at a Much faster rate than ourselves. The Amount they put out NOW is too much. Can you imagine 5 Times That?

Do you seriously think China putting out 5 Times what they put out now, and the US puting out 1.5 times what we put out now, and the rest of the world putting out 2X will have No effect on our Climate??

 

Hasn't it already been stated that 2-3 degree change in temperatures over 150 years may be normal?

Someone stated that in the 1300's the earth cooled and may have caused the plague. Was that also due to pollution by humans? Or was it a normal cycle in the earths temperature?

If they world temperatures could change on their own in the 1300s, they can change on their own in the 2000s.


To answer your last question. Of coarse I think more pollution will have some affect on the climate. But I think the change will be much smaller than the "Day after Tomorrow" movie suggests. Which is what the Al Gore's of the world want us to believe. "Everything is great today then all of a sudden we are all screwed"

That's not gonna happen. If it took us 150 years to pollute the world this bad surly we can have 50 years or so to make it better. To try to do it in a panic in 10 years is just stupid.

 

The earth puts off more pollutants by itself than mankind has ever thought of introducing. Dirty air doesn't automatically mean climate change it just means the air is not safe for humans to breathe. There have been reports by credible scientist saying that claim if we could magically stop putting and pollutants into the air the earth is still going to go through the same cycles as it does now. We don't contribute enough to make a difference.

The reason we don't here more from this point of view is
1. Nobody is paying enough money to people saying it's going to be OK don't worry about it.
2. The media only reports on what is interesting. Saying its OK is boring. Saying the ice caps are melting, the world is going to flood and everyone is going to die unless we change gets your attention.

Now I'm all for breathing cleaner air but I think we need to step back and see the big picture. For example our car emissions standards are a main cause why our MPG's are lower. So cars are putting of fewer pollutants into the air but at the same time making us use more gas/oil. Which means more drilling, refining ....etc which means the companies processing the oil to gas are putting off more pollutants into the air. Then there is the increase of pollutants from having to ship more oil to the US and distributing to the gas stations. Also an added bonus we get to be more dependent on foreign oil too just for wanting lower emissions.

Now you might say engines can be more efficient we just need to put the technology in them. Ok lets see what happens. It will drive the cost of cars up more so less people can afford them. Then with all of our infinite wisdom we'll probably pass more emission laws which more than likely drive down the efficiency again. It is just a vicious cycle which we have already been through.

Ok I'm sure I left out some points but oh well. My little rant is over.

 

I would say 150 years ago, people burned wood for heat, and whale blubber,
and olive oil for light. I guess the smoke blocked out some of the Suns emissions.

There was a time period when this planet was covered in forests. It had
such an oxygen rich atmosphere, that lightening strikes cause forest fires.
I'd guess we didn't have any effect then, since we wern't here yet.

R12 Freon may have caused some problems. But really, what do we have to
measure it by.

 

The hockey stick theory, or how screwed up it really is.


http://www.john-daly.com/hockey/hockey.htm

http://www.technologyreview.com/Energy/13830/

 

Good stuff! Especially the first link.

BTW, for those that like to see global warming dissected in novel form, read the late Michael Crichton's book, State of Fear.

Mr. Crichton also has an essay at the end of the book telling his personal thoughts and skepticism re: global warming/man made climate change. His essay is out there on the net if you search for it.

Crichton compares scientific and public acceptance of man-made climate change to another once-accepted junk 'science' known as Phrenology. Believers of Phrenology felt that intelligence, character and personality were linked to the shape and size of your skull and any bumps on your head. This concept was widely embraced by scientists, intellectuals, the common man and celebrities for decades. Products popped up to fill the mania. Many were convinced the science supporting their beliefs was above reproach.

Crichton felt that global warming/climate change was basically this generation's Phrenology, and he makes a pretty good case for it, too.

 

Just curious,
Do you guys think the hole in the ozone is bs? Do you think this is also cyclical in nature?
Do you think it matters?