Chris (great name by the way!), the oil crisis was caused by the middle east, this is an irrefutable fact. As of the most recent data available (2006), 16.92% of the oil we import comes from the middle east. This is also an irrefutable fact. I'm sorry if you don't like it, but it's the truth. That's why I questioned your age; everyone that was alive during the oil crisis in '73 knew all about the cause. OPEC cut us off. Let me say that again: THEY cut us off. It did not make them nervous, but it did scare the crap out of us.

Please don't tell me you're a Bible thumper, your comment about the age of the planet would normally be hysterical, but it concerns me why you might have said that.

FWIW, our economy is based on dollars and cents, not percentages. Every single one of my bills requires actual money to get paid, not percentages. I'm on no media bandwagon, I just deal with reality. As I've said, I could really care less how much money they made, I'm all for profit, but I'm not foolish enough to believe that drilling for oil in Alaska is going to benefit anyone other than them. Our own Energy Department said it won't help us. The idea that drilling up there will put fear into OPEC is ridiculous.

Do me a favor and enlighten me; what exactly is Obama going to do that should be scaring me so much?

Take care,
~Chris

 

That comment is so sad, there isn't even a word in the dictionary to describe how unbelievably dense someone would have to be to actually believe that.

I could see people believing that in the old days when science didn't have much to show us, but to believe such lunacy today, despite the staggering and contradictory evidence is simply chosing to be ignorant.

"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." -Albert Einstein

 

We are pretty much in agreement. I was trying to get the point across unsuccessfully. I got from your previous posts that we can't scare the OPEC nations because we don't get much oil from them. I was trying to point out that we can be independent of outside sources of oil, and OPEC WILL lower prices in response. If we started drilling everywhere as soon as possible, oil prices would drop drastically. Then the problem becomes that the tech to get some of this oil is to expensive to get at $80 a barrel when it was profitable at $140 a barrel. It will balance out. We just need to do something about it now, by drilling now. Raising taxes is what obama preaches. Raising taxes is exactly what we don't need when the economy has slowed down. He just commented we ARE in a recession. So now he is already changing national economic policy? By strict definition a recession is 2 straight quarters of negative growth. We haven't even had 1 quarter negative. And the unemployment rate is statistically full employment. There are many areas of the country with very hard times. But as a nation, we are OK for now. As for the economy being in dollars and cents, sure, but there is the problem of scale. While supplies for an individual costs so much... a large corparations supplies is proportionally higher. Hence the need for percentages to compare on the same level. Say you make a $100,000 a year... does that mean a corparation should make $100,000 a year? Nope.... And again, the corparations we are talking about are publicly owned.

If you choose to call me a Bible thumper, so be it. I prefer a Bible believer. As far as habibi's pathetic comments: not worth responding to as usual.

 

No, Chris, we aren't pretty much in agreement. If we authorized drilling everywhere today, it would not affect the amount of oil that OPEC sells. BTW, OPEC does not set the price, they set the amount they will produce. Speculators take it from there. If we started drilling everywhere, and the price of oil went down, it would be because of the speculators, not OPEC. Your concept of our being able to "scare the middle east" is not plausible.

You don't seem to understand what caused the oil crisis in '73, so I tried explaining it to you. Opec cut us off. We need them, they do not need us.

As far as Obama goes, if he becomes president, my taxes will go down. I'm not sure where your info comes from, but unless you're making more than $250k a year, yours will go down, too. I'm not sure how he thinks he's going to be able to start paying off China for all the money Bush borrowed from them for his war without raising everybody's taxes, but I guess he seems to think he knows some way.

As far as your religious beliefs, I respect your right to believe what ever you want to, but you have to understand that it's difficult for me to have an intelligent conversation with someone that believes in ghost stories, talking snakes, virgin births, etc., and who refuses to believe in proven science. Just out of curiosity, are you aware of the definition of the word 'theory' in scientific terms? A scientific theory exists by taking the best proven information out there and using it to form a conclusion. It is then given to the world at large to pick apart and disprove. Any scientific theory that lasts is as close as you are ever going to get to proven fact, and it will remain that way until it can be disproved.

 

Chris, yes we had some pretty heated debates when it comes to this stuff and I'm not here to rehash the past.

Does having a correct understanding of the true age of the earth make you less of a Christian or compromise your Christian beliefs?
I'm not being a smart *** either, this is "sincere" Habibi talking.

Just because I don't agree with theists or their ridiculous beliefs does not mean I don't respect your right to hold those beliefs.


"Smart" Chris is correct btw, it is difficult to carry on an intellectual debate with someone who refuses to pull his head out of the sand.

 

 

What have they contributed in the last two hundred years? Not much.

Grim

 

I get it.
So the last 200 years negates all the contributions of the first 3,800 years?
Is that how it works?

You can only invent Algebra once.

The Middle East / Persia has contributed much to the progress of mankind throughout history.
You coming along and so fliply saying "but what about the last 200 years?"
Doesn't change or detract all they have accomplished.

 

Let's be fair. Only somewhere between 1/3 and 1/4 of the last part of those 3800 years are Islamic. Let's also not forget that Hindus (The Worlds oldest religion) are the source of much of the Middle Eastern knowledge that was passed on to Western Europe, after much of it had been lost during the Dark Ages. It was at best a reintroduction of what was already known, or a substitution for lost knowledge never retrieved. If anything, Islam has put a slow halt to their intellectual contributions to the World... Beyond Philosophy.


http://www.ivarta.com/columns/OL_051210.htm

 

I'll agree that the Middle East had a modern, advanced society several centuries ago. Unfortunately, large segments of their culture has done little to advance since then. Much of Saudi is the same backwards country now that it was when Islam was founded. Other than oil and Dubai, what has the Middle East contributed lately?

Grim

Edit: Good grief, I just looked it up. Algebra was invented over 1,000 years ago. What have they done lately?

 

So cut their allowance.

I suspect they're content being the worlds premiere oil supplier for the past 50 years. It's worked well for them.

 

Ok, the real rich ones are stretching the world's best engineers to the limit with 'extreme engineering'.

The real rich ones know how to hand pick the hottest chicks from Italy, does that count for anything?

In all seriousness, Burt made a comment that they never did chit for humanity, and I just wanted to point out to him that he was a little misinformed.

I do understand his frustration with the middle east because I share the same frustrations, but painting everyone with the same brush isn't justified.

Regards

 

You are correct. I admit, they sounded pretty weak, but it wasn't until this morning when I was checking Snopes.com about an email I received that I came across THIS. Figured it was worth sharing.