The only place the F-35 beats the F-22 is on price. The F-22 is very likely to be the best ever manned fighter. The only reason the DoD isn't buying more of them is the $100mil price tag. There is nothing in the air that can touch the F-22.

 

...except another F-22.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...?hpid=sec-tech

I read this above linked atricle at work today. The above quote sums it up rather nicely. Legacy fighters are on the way out. Their time has been served.

 

I disagree with his statements... I think the F-14, F-15, F-16 & F-18 are more than a match for the Air Forces, and Anti-Aircraft defenses of any country on the planet. I mean, think about it- The B-52 is 50 years old, and expected to serve until 2040 (Long after they retire the newer, faster, ~and more capable~ B1 Lancer). Now, if the radar signature, and vulnerability of the B52 (Which got shot down left & right in Vietnam) made it through Baghdad (The most heavily defended airspace in the history of warfare) without a scratch- I find it hard to believe that given our warfighting tactics, the current fighters would be sitting ducks in China, or any other country.

Once the F-117's and B-2's go in, and pluck their eyes out (Radar), it's party time...

With no guidance, andnot being able to track threats, we could go in with P-51 Mustangs, A-10 Thunderbolt II's, and B-29 SuperFortresses, and handle business against anyone short of China and Russia.

My thing is, if they're so good (F-22 & F-35) why sell/export them?

I certainly wouldn't want to face an F-22 in a war; even if I was in my own F-22. Not if one F-22 can shoot down four F-15's (A plane that has never lost an air to air fight- it's the Floyd Mayweather of aerial combat). For teh F-15 to go 0 - 4 against the F-22- tells me that's not a plane I want to sell to anyone. I'd sell them the F-15, but not the 22. A plane that good, I have to assume it can take out other F-22's as well- especially if you can't see it coming.

If I did sell it, it would be powered by the F-5 Tiger's jet engines, be made of a highly reflective material, and the engines would also be bombs, which I could activate via satellite- grounding their force of F-22's before they even got off the ground.

 

I did read one thing about an F-22 fight tactic. While I'm sure it's BS (Since they told the world on the Military Channel) this is what they said they'd do.

The F-22's radar is much better than everyone else's, and well beyond the enemy's radar, the F-22's (Flying in a group of 2) would spot the enemy long before they were spotted. Once IFF confrimed they are enemies, one F-22 would hug the ground (even harder to see) and go straight for them, while the other F-22 (decoy) made himself visible to the approaching enemy. Not at a distance that they can engage, but at the edge of their radar's performance. That will draw their attention, and they will pursue the elusive F-22.

Meanwhile, F-22 #1 has closed on them, and they have flown over him in hot pursuit of the other F-22. F-22 #1 climbs to altitude, and has the squadron of enemy fighters at his 12 o'clock, he's on their 6. He select the appropriate missle, and before they know anything, he's got a lock on them.


Two choices remain at that point-

• Eject
• Kaboom

Currently, aside from the F-22 and (As yet undeployed) SU-37 Flanker, only the Euro-Fighter is said to be a match (or perhaps more capable) than the F-15.

 

Hersh:

You're off on a few points.

My thing is, if they're so good (F-22 & F-35) why sell/export them?

The F-22 currently can not be exported per the DoD export rules. The F-35 is the US designation for the JSF. That aircraft was designed to be exported and there are scores of countries that will operate them. Edit: Even the F-15s we sell are not as good as ours.

Currently, aside from the F-22 and (As yet undeployed) SU-37 Flanker, only the Euro-Fighter is said to be a match (or perhaps more capable) than the F-15.

If you look at the results of South Korea's next fighter jet competition the F-15 was beaten in combat. Can you guess the aircraft that actually won?

Hint: The POS Eurofighter did not even make the finals.


It was the Dassault Rafale.


The only reason that the F-15 was chosen was Washington to Seoul political deals.

 

http://www.af.mil/photos/index.asp?galleryID=13

On a side note, the F-22 is an air superiority fighter & the F-35 is a multi-role fighter. There is no real comparison between them since they aren't designed for nor used for the same missions. This is the same reason a F-15 will take out a F-16 80% of the time. Apples to oranges.

KC-10 FE out...

 

Hello Wookie-

Yeah, I know the F-15's we sell others are watered down versions of our own. I wouldn't even sell the watered down version to anyone- but, I'm not in charge!

Imagine my surprise to see South Korean's driving M1 tanks when I was in Korea. I was like, What the......?

Then, one day- I realy looked at it, and really listened to it as it went by, and then I realized that it might look like ours, but it's not like ours. Saudi Arabia has F-15's too, didn't see any major differences there, but I'm sure the engines and electronics were not the same.

It's hard to believe the Rafael defeated the F-15.

I've read that the US is entertaining the notion of exporting the F-22 to friendly nations, Japan being one of them. Glad to see we aren't selling our best fighter to other countries- like we did with the F-14 to Iran, and the F-15 to everyone with a check book, who said they liked us.

F-15 vs F16 Dogfight: Video

OPERATION RED FLAG:

http://www.defencetalk.com/military_...t_20060904.php

This to me is a coin toss. One thing I'd read says nothing can turn in like the F-15. I'll read something else that says the fly-by-wire, an built in instability make the F-16 the most agile fighter in the inventory- and the best dogfighter. When it comes to BVR engagement, nothing can match the F-14 (So why retire it?), and the F-18 is just the cat's meow- when it comes to multi-role fighters. So, yes- they all have their strengths and weaknesses, but- at their core, they're still fighters and subject (very likely) to find themselves in a dogfight.

I like the F-15, so I'll say the F-15 will win against an F-16, but I think what it would boil down to is, who is on whose "6". I don't think the F-15 could shake an F-16 loose, in time to fend off a missle from the F-16.

But, what I have ALWAYS wanted to see, or read about- but never did is, what would win between the F-14 and F-15. That, to me- would be a real fight. The F-15 is slightly faster andslightly more powerful, so I think it woudl have a small advantage on paper. But, with the F-14's early retirement, we'll never know.

I don't know if they were allies or enemies, but the coolest "chase" I ever saw was an F-4 Phantom chasing a Panavia Tornado over West Texas during Roving Sands: 1996. They couldn't have been more than 200 - 300 feet above the desert floor, and had to be running over 300 - 400 MPH... They were cooking.

I saw a lot of cool stuff during that exercise, including a diving, then low-altitude pass by a B-1. We woke up every morning to the soundtrack of an F-117 passing over our site numerous times, being chased by a lear jet (I assume taking photos).

 

Hersh:
When you get the time look up the results of the South Korea tests, it was one of the best comparisons of everyone's hardware. All of the major players were involved U.S., Russia and several Euro designs. The Rafale is actually a da*n fine fighter that is hindered by politics. In a heads up fight there are very few aircraft that stand a chance.