A&M vs. the Seahawks
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Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 1,506
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From: Bakersfield, CA, USA
I did not realize A&M was in business, and that it's livelihood and income depended on protecting it's trademark of 12th Man.
The $10,000 Allen offered could have been used to provide a valuable A&M education to a needy young person, but I guess that does not suit the A&M agenda.
If protecting the marketability of the words 12th Man is important to A&M, they have been doing a damn poor job. Afterall, me and millions of other football fans have used the words 12th man for decades and never associated the phrase with A&M in any way whatsoever.
It must really gall you that basketball fans might refer to themselves as the 6th man, or baseball fans might call themselves the 10th man. Does A&M lay claim to any profits from shirts and promotions in other sports, or does their moral high ground only apply to football?
It is true that Paul Allen is a billionaire, but he is not the one trying to take two common words and restrict the use of them. Shame on you for trying to make it seem like he is wrong just because he is rich. Class warfare has nothing to do with this issue.
Bottom Line - 12th Man has becom a common part of the culture in a way that has nothing to do with A&M. You can't undo that with some silly little peice of 10 year old paper and a nice 80 year old story.
The $10,000 Allen offered could have been used to provide a valuable A&M education to a needy young person, but I guess that does not suit the A&M agenda.
If protecting the marketability of the words 12th Man is important to A&M, they have been doing a damn poor job. Afterall, me and millions of other football fans have used the words 12th man for decades and never associated the phrase with A&M in any way whatsoever.
It must really gall you that basketball fans might refer to themselves as the 6th man, or baseball fans might call themselves the 10th man. Does A&M lay claim to any profits from shirts and promotions in other sports, or does their moral high ground only apply to football?
It is true that Paul Allen is a billionaire, but he is not the one trying to take two common words and restrict the use of them. Shame on you for trying to make it seem like he is wrong just because he is rich. Class warfare has nothing to do with this issue.
Bottom Line - 12th Man has becom a common part of the culture in a way that has nothing to do with A&M. You can't undo that with some silly little peice of 10 year old paper and a nice 80 year old story.
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Senior Member
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From: Aggieland, TX
Originally Posted by Raoul
That was, I repeat for emphasis, 1984.
Texas A&M applied for Trademark in 1992 and again in 1996.
If it was me, I would throw the Flag on A&M for clipping but, you decide.
Texas A&M applied for Trademark in 1992 and again in 1996.
If it was me, I would throw the Flag on A&M for clipping but, you decide.
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Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,053
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From: Aggieland, TX
"Afterall, me and millions of other football fans have used the words 12th man for decades and never associated the phrase with A&M in any way whatsoever."
Just because you have been using it all your life and you didnt know where the term came from, doesnt make it ok for other teams to use the term.
As much as you may like or dislike A&M (obvious where you stand there), it doesnt really matter if you think we "deserve" to hold the trademark, whether or team sucks, whatever. We own the trademark.
Also, A&M doesnt hold an agenda, we're just asking the Seahawks to stop using the phrase.
Just because you have been using it all your life and you didnt know where the term came from, doesnt make it ok for other teams to use the term.
As much as you may like or dislike A&M (obvious where you stand there), it doesnt really matter if you think we "deserve" to hold the trademark, whether or team sucks, whatever. We own the trademark.
Also, A&M doesnt hold an agenda, we're just asking the Seahawks to stop using the phrase.
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Joined: Jan 2003
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From: Pikesville, MD
1st step in the NFL's victory just occured:
12th Man Dispute Sent to Federal Court
By JACKSON HOLTZ Associated Press Writer
© 2006 The Associated Press
BRYAN, Texas — The Seattle Seahawks ran an end-around on Texas A&M, filing notice Thursday to remove from an Aggie hometown court the dispute over the "12th Man" slogan.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/...l/3632234.html
12th Man Dispute Sent to Federal Court
By JACKSON HOLTZ Associated Press Writer
© 2006 The Associated Press
BRYAN, Texas — The Seattle Seahawks ran an end-around on Texas A&M, filing notice Thursday to remove from an Aggie hometown court the dispute over the "12th Man" slogan.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/...l/3632234.html
Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 6
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From: Frisco, TX
Mr. Allen is not wrong because he is rich, and I never said that, what I implied is he is arrogant because he is rich. If he was not, he would have no problem either adhering to the Cease and Desist order, or he would attempt to obtain a license from A&M for the legal use of the term buy summitting a realistic offer. By the way, a $1000.00 a year offer carries about as much weight with Texas A&M as it does with Mr. Allen. Tip money if you will. Do not think for one minute that colleges are not a business. You would be amazed at the dollars they control. A&M happens to have the 2 largest endowment in the Country just behind Harvard. From what I have read, it is close to 10 Billion dollars. As stated by someone else, the school makes millions of dollars a year from their registered 12th man trademark, an millions more from the other dozen or so trademarks they own.
As I said before, "saying" the term 12th man does not constitute trademark infringement. Using the term "The 12th Man" to promote your football team, label a contest, or sell merchandise does. It's no different than Starbucks suit against Sambucks coffee. Guess what, Starbucks won even though the ladies name who owned the coffee shop was named Samantha Buck. Simple trademark infringement. How about when Microsoft sued to stop the release of Lindows. Guess what, Microsoft won. Simple trademark infringement. But wait, I thought Windows was a "common" word as you put it. How on earth could they sue? Well I guess you figured out where I am going with this. A&M has been associated with the term The 12th man since it's inception and owns the trademark. Common word or not, it still identifies the Aggie student body and is held very dear by the school and everyone else associated with the school. Hell, just last year College Football News named it the coolest tradition in all of football.
http://www.collegefootballnews.com/2..._Tradition.htm
The term simply defines Texas A&M
Please understand, it is not about "moral ground". I really have a hard time understanding where you get that in the first place. It is about owning something and having someone use it, and profit by it, without your permission. Nothing about morals there. Pretty cut and dried really.
As I said before, "saying" the term 12th man does not constitute trademark infringement. Using the term "The 12th Man" to promote your football team, label a contest, or sell merchandise does. It's no different than Starbucks suit against Sambucks coffee. Guess what, Starbucks won even though the ladies name who owned the coffee shop was named Samantha Buck. Simple trademark infringement. How about when Microsoft sued to stop the release of Lindows. Guess what, Microsoft won. Simple trademark infringement. But wait, I thought Windows was a "common" word as you put it. How on earth could they sue? Well I guess you figured out where I am going with this. A&M has been associated with the term The 12th man since it's inception and owns the trademark. Common word or not, it still identifies the Aggie student body and is held very dear by the school and everyone else associated with the school. Hell, just last year College Football News named it the coolest tradition in all of football.
http://www.collegefootballnews.com/2..._Tradition.htm
The term simply defines Texas A&M
Please understand, it is not about "moral ground". I really have a hard time understanding where you get that in the first place. It is about owning something and having someone use it, and profit by it, without your permission. Nothing about morals there. Pretty cut and dried really.