I stand corrected. I hope that all 5.4 owners accept my sincere apology...



E...

 

*Deleted* - Hit the wrong d@mn button!

 

no apology needed.

These are the #1 trucks for a reason.

You want elec fans? Get some. The vast majority couldn't care. Ford gets that. GM doesn't. That's why the F150 is still the best selling vehicle.

 

With all of the talk by the automakers about changing the volts of the electrical system due to all of the electric goodies on modern vehicles, electric fans seems a very temproary fix to a minor problem. So the end question is why waste the money? The other issue is with S&P downgrading Ford and GM's bonds and most of the press centering on GM, I'd say Ford is doing better than GM.

 

Sorry, but I can't agree with that.

Lets say Ford, GM or whoever offered their trucks both ways. John Doe truck shopper is scanning the dealer lot for a truck. The salesman shows him a truck with an EPA rating of 14/18, then he shows him the exact same model, with a sticker $300 more, and an EPA rating of 16/20. You're saying the vast majority wouldn't care? I know I would....

Now that I can agree with. Of all the Silverados I've had as rentals (been about 6 so far), there ain't a single one of the bunch I would want to own. After driving them, it becomes very clear why Ford has been the top selling truck manufacturer for many years running.

The dealer that does my repairs has an Enterprise rental agency on the lot (kinda makes ya wonder, huh ), and on one repair visit, I saw an 05 F-150 extended cab there. I asked if it was theirs and if I could get it instead of another Silverado. GM wouldn't pay for it, so I rented it myself for the day.

There's no comparison between the 05 F-150 and an 05 Chebby. Like night and day.

E...

 

Actually, they're both pooping in our collective corn flakes right now. Two of the largest companies in north america just had to come up with more operating cash because of the downgrade; this on top of already not being profitable.

There are VERY serious doubts that Ford and GM are even viable over the long term right now and the market is starting to react to it.

Why? The money has to come from somewhere.

Where does the money come from?

Well, let's talk about where it can't come from.

1) Rising gasoline prices and a tepid economy pushed the SUV and truck market into a downward trend.

2) The production costs of the mustang have yet to be paid; the price of the design work, factory restructuring, marketing, etc. Are, by design, recovered after the vehicle hits the market; in other words Ford is stilling paying off the costs of the various production inputs to build the Mustang in the first place.

3) The 500. A flop. A nice car, but no one cares because it looks like everything else. Everyone wants Honda, Toyota, or Nissan.

4) Unions. When are the contracts up, and what do you think the odds are of the UAW taking a pay cut?

What next? The more I think about it, the more GM is headed for Bankruptcy. That's the only way they're going to be able to clean up their debt, get out of the ridiculous union contracts, etc. Ford? Personally, I think there's going to be a merger. With whom? Well..just an outside left field guess...have you thought about filling up your gas tank at the local FordExxon station?

I know It'll never happen. I'll shut up now.

-Fatz

 

Am I the only one who reads the annual report from Ford. They made more per share last year than they have since before Nasser was fired. The downgrade was based on lagging sales of trucks and SUVs not on the profit being made by the company. Each unit (car and truck) has more profit in it now than it did 4 years ago.

 

I don't think that the survival of Ford or GM is in jeapordy anytime in the near future, but that doesn't hold true for their parts suppliers.

In an effort to keep their same bottom line numbers despite the lagging sales, GM and Ford have been pressuring Delphi and Visteon (respectively) to cut their parts prices.

When you start hearing of mass layoffs at Delphi and Visteon, then we'll have a problem.

From Visteon's site:

At least the parts supply will be good until the beginning of next year.

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we can agree to diagree. Do people care? Of course. The only question is how many. I still believe tried-and-true truck buyers that want a truck understand the fuel downside. and the reality is, 14/18 and 16/20 aren't are that far apart and is not a deal killer when one truck meets their needs/wanst better than the other. It's not like comparing a 14/18 truck to a 30/36 small car.

But like I said, the question is "how many truly care" and the answer to that is what Ford should be listening to.

 

I never said a GM truck could pass a Ford hot weather test.