I have been throughly reading almost every thread on this forum for the last 3 or 4 months, and I think I've really learned a lot about F150s. The other day I was talking to my dad about my new FX4 thats currently being built and told him how I wanted to buy a tuner to help wake up the engine. He asked me a tough question that I didn't know how to answer. If there is more avaliable power in an F150, why don't the engineers at Ford take advantage of it and deliever a more powerful truck straight out of the factory? I'm sure all the R&D guys a Ford know there is still potential under the hood. Then there are also the improved shift points tuners provide. Better towing configurations, increased fuel economy, faster 0-60 times, and the list could go on. It would be naive to think that SCT, Edge, Diablo, ect. has engineers that can outprogram the PCMs put out by the same engineers who built the 3V 5.4. So why are tuners needed? Now I understand that you can't maximize "performance" and still safely tow due to exhaust temps and things of that nature. Is that why Ford waters down their stock 5.4, to provide more all around functionality? Do they think (or know) milder tunes will increase the longevity of the drivetrain? Don't get me wrong, I plan on getting a tuner. I'm not knocking anyone who claims that tuners offer significant improvement. I've driven my dads 2005 4.2, and also my brother-in-laws 5.4, so I know the kind of output these trucks do and don't have. I guess its the same with intakes too. Some boast 20+ RWHP, but don't speak of any ill effects on the engine. If Ford could provide more HP without sacrificing durability, which seems to be what tuners do, it would only increase their bottom line which, has taken some hits lately... Anyway you all get my point. Sorry for the long post. Maybe the answer is obvious and I'm overlooking it. Thanks for helping me out guys!

Justin

 

Troyer as approached these questions before. I can't really remember but you are generally correct about the "drivability" Ford wants to claim about the truck. Something was also said about Ford targeting more female drivers for the F-150, etc.

You could try to use the SEARCH feature for these answers but it would be kind of hard to use a word or two to find the info on it.

Good luck.

 

Also, the performance levels are not tuned for towing. If you don't engineer a way for people to change programs for different requirements......you got to give them one that works for all of them. Kinda of like "good at everything...master of none".

 

I was kind of afraid this had been discussed on here before but like you mentioned, not the easiest topic to seach for. I kinda figured that was the reason why. I know this would never happen but I wonder how consumers would respond if Ford offered a more performance geared model with a better tune. The Lightinings are still overwhelmingly popular, and while a better tune is no blower Ford could still make 500 or 600 dollars easily by just uploading a different program. Shoot, how many members of this site would pay up? Am I crazy? Just a thought. Thanks for the quick reply.

 

Some guys are still reporting 0-60 times around 2 seconds faster than stock using a towing tune. I know the arguement a truck is a truck and that 0-60 shouldn't matter, but why not have the best truck possible. Not to mention increased fuel efficiency and shift points which some people claim increases the life of the tranny due to reduced slippage. That may be claim that isn't entirely factual, but someone who knows more about these things than me had that opinion. Just seems like an obvious win win situation.
I'm not trying to start any arguements. Lets just say I have a strong sense of curiosity. Thanks again.

 

IMHO, some reasons:

1) Agressive shift points and firmness are not compatible with towing.

2) A tune optimized for high octane would not work for the mass market because many would try to be cheap and run 87 and damage their engine over time.

3) Even if Ford did provide a way to switch tunes between high and low octane and towing vs performance, it would still be too complex of a process for most people and would result in higher occurance of warranty claims, lawsuits etc.

4) The F Series didn't become the mass market high volume seller that it is by sacrificing versatility. These trucks are work horses out of the factory. Treat them reasonably well and they will answer the call, day in and day out. They are not, for the most part, intended to be a vehicle that appeals to the boutique buyer.

 

Yeah, as said, it's not the easiest thing to search for without getting hundreds of posts about other topics. I'd definately pay more money knowing what I do now about their stock programming. I am also glad to see their is a niche for people to correct this problem with *custom* tuning!

 

Those are some very logical points jmcmike. I'm not trying to dog Fords' Engineers, just learn. Thanks for enlightening me!! But by a boutique buyer do you mean someone who seeks more performance? I'm just presenting the fact that people have claimed a lot better performance for a "towing" tune, which is certainly tow capable and has increased fuel effieciency. Most of these claims were all from members running the Edge, which is set up for 87 octane. (Since thats what I've decided to purchase thats what I have familiarized myself with) Some say they use the tow tune for an everyday driver, and the difference is night and day. I know it wouldn't be practical, or even feasable to offer different tunes for the same truck, but I honestly can't think of many F150 owners would given the option for free of even a small fee, turn down a setup that provides something similar to what the Edge or Troyer can provide in a is known as a "tow tune". I guess maybe what I'm hinting at is could there be ANY possibilty of long term negative effect? Otherwise, I still see it as a win win situation for both Ford and consumers. Like I said, I'm still planning on purchasing a tuner. Food for thought...

 

To put my spin on things I think in the future the major companies might make onboard tuning a reality.I am pretty sure that major companies have people who just surf the web and find the interests of the public.The major companies would also cover their liability/warranty clauses in the sales contract. Just a matter of time.

 

The reason Ford doesn't "tune" them from the factory is because they're made to last a long time. You can turn up hp, and make the truck shift hard etc. but it isn't "better" as far as longevity is concerned. Think of it this way. If you increase hp, is it gonna increase longevity? No.

And as for gas mileage... If Ford had a way to increase gas mileage without sacrificing some other aspect of the vehicle, it would. Keep those things in mind when thinking about "tuners".

 

jmo

In my opinion Ford doesn't go for higher performance because many buyers just aren't interested in the extra cost.... Ford puts tuning in the truck that will run on the worst gasoline available. Ford has the tranny slipping for those "smooth" shifts that many buyers prefer. Of course the public doesn't realize that the smoother the shift, the more the tranny slips, the more heat it produces, the sooner it will fail. Mr. Troyer has posted often on this forum about the necessity of more and better maintenance on these trucks - particularly after installing his tuning. I think the general public would not be willing to fuel these trucks with the best fuel rather than the cheapest. I think most folks aren't willing to pay for or do the maintenance performance tuning requires. Example the general public isn't going to pay for new upstream O2 sensors at 45,000 miles when Ford never even mentions them in the maintenance paperwork. The general public isn't going to change plugs at 30,000 miles when they bought a truck with "100,000 tune-up" intervals.

enb

 

This is the single most simple aspect of "why does the aftermarket exist?" - Because NO automaker makes their vehicles to perfectly suit each and every single owner - its that simple.

They also have to offer a one-size-fits-all solution when it comes to the PCM calibration (tuning), whereas we deliver *multiple* different tunes to suit any needed purpose, to the owner has that kind of flexibility - but heck, even in their "performance" vehicles we can add a significant amount of power and not shorten their lifespan - but that DOES take quite a bit of experience and knowledge gained thru years of R&D to actually be able to do this and know what can and cannot be done and retain full OEM reliability.

It's also in part a matter of time - we specialize in modifying these trucks for more performance at many different levels, that is what we do - whereas Ford has to do everything from make glass (and they make some of the very best auto glass in the world, so good that numerous other automakers buy their glass from Ford!) to interior parts to everything else that goes into these trucks, design them, and configure them in a manner that their bean counters think will result in the highest number of sales - which means, in short, making them most appealing to WOMEN, as WOMEN decide what vehicle will be bought in over 70% of all vehicles purchased in America - and they directly buy more than 50% of all vehicles sold - so the automakers are concerned about one thing more than any other single factor - whatever it takes to sell more vehicles to WOMEN.

The bottom line is, no vehicle is *ever* fully optimized from the factory - I don't care if it's a Corvette, a Porsche, or an F-150 - none of them are the way a lot of us owners want them off the assembly line. And in the case of the 2004 & newer F-150, there is so much room for improvement in overall driveability, power, performance, and so many other aspects without shortening the powertrain's service life one iota, that we are always having people come to us to improve these vehicles.

It's very simple - Ford makes them for what they think is the lowest common denominator - whereas we tune & otherwise modify them for the more discriminating buyer, the owner who *cares* about getting more from their vehicle. And while we're at it, let's also point out another truth - that Ford does a *wonderful* job of designing & building the best damned trucks in the world, and for that we sincerely THANK them - job well done, Ford!

The bottom line is, it's *always* been that way, because major automakers are NOT run by engineers or by "car guys" - they are run by bean counters, who are concerned about maximum vehicle sales and keeping their plants running, people working, etc - and in the process, unfortunately, end up to a certain extent kinda "dummying down" some of their vehicles to the point that some owners want better performance, or handling, or what have you - and that is why the aftermarket exists, to serve the more discriminating owner. So many aspects are easily improved upon by us, because we have specialized in doing precisely that for 14+ years - which is why so many F-series owners come to us for their tuning & other performance needs.

This is not heard to search for - you simply need to phrase your search correctly, and spend some time working with the search engine's filters here - you will find literally tens of thousands of posts chock-full of excellent info on this topic, and the answer.

The bottom line is that it is very easy for us to improve on these vehicles, because Ford, like virtually every other automaker, isn't configuring them specifically for "the best possible performance," just for example - they are configuring them to what the automakers think will appeal more to WOMEN, because they are the largest car-buying group of people in the world.

Luckily for those who insist on a product that we feel better suits *our* individual tastes, there are companies like us who devote ourselves to doing just that - taking the very best pickup truck in the world and taking it to the next logical step - optimizing it so that you can actually enjoy what it really is capable of.