Howdy! I've heard that an aftermarket performance chip is often worth more as a first mod than say, and exhaust system or an intake system. Is this true? It it really a "best bang for your buck" mod? What are the disadvantages of running a chip?

 

The "three best bangs for your buck"; reprogram, intake mods, exhaust mods.
Only down thing about reprogramming is that you end up having to use premium fuel.

 

Thanks for the timely response! I'm aware of the premium fuel requirement. But I've heard about supposed fuel efficency increases. Is this true, and if so, is it enough to recover the cost of having to run premium? On a stock engine what can be the expected power gains and where in the RPM band are they?

 

Also, I've read (in this forum) that you can run a chip tuned to run on regular fuel (87 octane). What's the deal with this?

 

I'm surprised someone hasn't jumped on this earlier. You do not have to use premium fuel with a tuner, however you do have that option.

I have an 87 octane and 2 93 octane tunes with my x-cal. Obviously, when I run my 87 tune I use 87 octane fuel. You don't get quite the performance on the 87 tune that you do with the 93 tune. I currently on a 93 tune and love it. A fill up with 87 is roughly $67.50, 93 is $73.50, when you paying that much what's another $6.

 

The XCal2 with Troyer’s custom tunes is the #1 "biggest bang for the buck mod"

 

Power gains are throughout the rpm range, from dyno plots Ive seen I believe the best gains were in the 3500-4500 range is where the biggest gain over stock was. And yes you can typically run either fuel. Your programmer will most likely have more than one, probably 3 programs, you can choose between. And the 91 octance tune will be your best performing one which is really pretty neat about these new 3 valve engines. Most trucks really dont see a significant gain when running 91 octane even when tuned for it due to the compression ratio being too low, but this new ford 3 valve motor actually sees a significant gain and will perform very well with an 87 octane tune and then again with a 91 octane tune.

 

Personally, I stay away from generic rankings like programming then intake then exhaust.

First, it may be different for vehilce make, engine size and model year.

Second, the ranking is also dependent on what you are trying to accomplish.

To my mind, the programming/intake/exhaust ranking implies that everyones number 1 priority is hp increase per dollar spent. That implied assumption may be true in most cases, but if it isn't stated, then it can lead to confusion.

I always go for mods that improve both hp and gas mileage first and then consider mods that improve hp but are unclear as to their impact on mileage. Also, as mentioned, I don't assume that the mod order is the same on every vehicle. I look under the hood, crawl under the truck with a tape measure and read what other people have found out before I get started.

As an example, on my truck, a 2004 5.4L 3v, the intake is a must replace, regardless of what else is done. This was obvious to me after spending about 2 minutes under the hood. As it turns out, I got a big gain in both power and gas mileage with a Volant intake system. People on this board seem to think the AF1 intake delivers a bigger power increase, but I cannot confirm that.

I was asked advice on a 1999 4.6L F150 last weekend so I had an opportunity to look under the hood of an older truck. It appeared to me that the intake system on that truck was inefficient, but not to the same extent as my 2004. Also, it looked like it might be possible, on that truck, to buy a high performance filter and some inexpensive hardware and modify the factory intake without replacing it entirely.

Exhaust is always a touchy subject because of the low end torque issue. If you want towing power instead of drag racing power, you need to carefully read about exhaust back pressure and low end torque... and then possibly ask advice.

Summarizing all that, my advice is do your homework on your specific vehicle and then you will have an idea what the best order is for you. Or you can ask Mike. He's toyed with many of the Ford trucks and after market toys and can probably send you in the right direction. He also adresses the issue of different needs for different folks. His performance mods come in towing and drag racing varieties. This is somewhat unusual in the mod field.

By the way, my Troyer xcal2 is supposed to arrive tomorrow. After receiving it, I may change my mind about the appropriate mod order on my vehicle. I will be suprised if that happens, especially considering the mileage gains I got out of the Volant. However, I will post my impressions, once I've had a chance to tow and collect a bit of mileage data.

Enjoy.

 

So, tomorrow you join the coveted ranks of believer, welcome aboard

 

We will see. I am looking forward to it. I hesitated to tune this truck due to suboptimal performance I got out of a chip in my last truck. All the Troyer praise on this website sort of talked me into trying it again.

Unfortunately, it will probably take me a little while to see how well it works for me. I was hoping to use it on a trip I just got back from, but the delay nixed that. My next major trip isn't until mid September, so that's the first real test.

I will be towing my 5th wheel about 160 miles this weekend, but I don't recall any serious hills on the trip. Also, I have 1/2 tank of 87 octane to work through, so I may not be able to use the 93 tow tune on the outbound leg of the trip.

 

Hi cpaggie_07,

Actually, it is NOT true these days that you have to use premium gas to get good results from our tuning. Now that is something that USED to be the case years & years ago, but changed quite some time ago - so there may still be some people who are under that impression.

For example, in the new 5.4 3V F-150's, we getting easy gains of 25+ more horsepower at the rear wheels, and an easy 40-50 more lbs./ft of torque - and much more on premium gas!

In *any* of these vehicles, these days we can easily deliver worthwhile gains on 87 octane fuels - now what we DO say is that you can't use JUNK fuels - you know, how some people make the mistake of buying the absolute cheapest gas they can find, thinking that all fuels are the same - they're not, not by a long shot. When using our premium gas tuning, usually the increase in fuel mileage is just about enough (and in some cases, more) to offset the cost of premium gasoline over regular gas, depending on fuel quality & how you drive it, of course. The truth is, the higher that gas prices go, the better chance you have of making up that entire cost differential per gallon, as the differential per gallon between 87 & premium stays pretty much the same overall.

It's not possible to tell you an exact HP gain from our tuning that would be correct for each and every different F-150 configuration, we'd have to know your exact vehicle, model year, engine, transmission, it's maintenance history, any modifications, etc - there are simply far too many variables to give exact numbers that are going to apply to each and every vehicle. If you'd like to shoot us an email with that specific info, we'll try to help you out with that info.

However, it's a no-brainer that our custom tuning is by far the single best bang-for-the-buck performance enhancement you can make to thee vehicles, as nothing else for the same or less cost will improve the performance as much - which is why our Troyer Performance tuning is so popular.

In general, your best Top 3 bang-for-the-buck mods in these trucks (and many other vehicles) are: Our tuning, intake kits, and then cat-back exhaust systems - and that is usually the order that most people do their mods in, as they are most concerned about bang for the buck,

HI hope that info helps, and please feel free to give us a call to go over all of this in proper detail!

 

Well according to this comment I am guilty as charged. I mainly use Shell 87-93 octane and Diamond Shamrock 87-93, because it is the cheapest near my house. What are your brand preferences for quality fuel?

 

Hi jrack,

Nah, you're not guilty of anything as I see it!

Shell is generally a good fuel in many areas.

Now Diamond Shamrock I am not a big fan of, I got a lot of exposure to it when I worked out "in the oil patch," as they say. It's a Mid-Western-based brand, generally speaking, and we do consider them to be an "off-brand," though I'm sure they wouldn't take kindly to me saying that!!!

So let's talk about getting down to the real truth...........

Do fuel mileage tests during the same time of year - you know, clear the PCM and then run 3 tanks of each type of gas under the same driving conditions, and the fuel that delvers the highest MPG under the same basic conditions is generally the fuel with the highest energy convent - for them it's a matter of how "clean" the fuel is, the quality and quality of their detergent additives.

Just don't forget to clear the PCM by disconnecting the battery for a few minutes each time you change brands, and test during the same time of year - don't compare "winterized" fuels to "summer blends" as the summer blends will always have a higher BTU content and thus skew the results.

Hey, you never know - you just might find out that your local Diamond Shamrock has a decent energy content, and we love adding more fuels to our "recommend fuels" list!

 

What fuels are currently on your "recommend fuels" list?

 

Hi - that's been posted *many* times - and it also seems to depend upon geographic location, but if you can find Sunoco Ultra ( 93 or 94 ) it appears to be consistently good. Even their 87 gave me no problems.

As for Shell - well, the 'corporate fuel' I normally use is from Shell according to our purchase rep. But I wonder, Mike if there is 'SHELL' and there is 'shell'... the stuff arrives in an unmarked tanker from a third party supplier, and even though our pump says 'Supreme 92 octane', I need to use the 91 octane tune you did for me to run it without pinging ( the BADGAS tune ;-)).

A full tank or 92 octane Sunoco doesn't exhibit the same issues, so I supplement the 'corp gas' with Sunoco as much as I can, given the extreme price difference between the two, and fuel prices in canada in general ( right now Sunoco 87 is running 95 cents/litre = $4.27/Canadian gallon ) ... can you spell 'ouch' ?

PS - BTW Mike, I found my 'visible' manual tranny - posted that a ways down , under 'programming 93' ;-)) - yup, hijacked another one - RP is gonna be PO'd!


Cheers!
Vic