Mass Airflow
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Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 820
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From: LA
Mass Airflow
Mike or anyone who knows, do these help on the F-150. The guys on the Lightning forums swear by them. If I get one will my chip need changes? I think you have answered this before, but I have an illness called CRS and it stands for can't remember sh&t. Thanks and what about the throttle body?
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OO L Black, Superchip R9, Airaid FIPK and Tonneau cover: 1999 F-150 Lariat SC 2 WD, White/Silver, 5.4L, 3.55LS, K & N FIPK, Superchip, underdrive pulley set, Flowmaster dual chamber one in and duels out, six disc CD changer, towing package and captain chairs
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OO L Black, Superchip R9, Airaid FIPK and Tonneau cover: 1999 F-150 Lariat SC 2 WD, White/Silver, 5.4L, 3.55LS, K & N FIPK, Superchip, underdrive pulley set, Flowmaster dual chamber one in and duels out, six disc CD changer, towing package and captain chairs
Former Sponsor
Joined: Mar 1998
Posts: 13,385
Likes: 4
From: Virginia
Hi Mikey,
CRS, eh? Too funny! I think most of us are affected by that at one time or another.
Larger aftermarket mass airflow meters can be very beneficial, but not on a basically stock engine. Until the engine has been modified to the point where it's literally capable of out-stripping the flow capacity of the stock MAF & throttle body, you won't see any power gains from increased airflow capacity, and that applies to the Lightning as well. The manufacturers of these parts *know* this, and so what they do to achieve a power gain on a stock or close to stock engine is to lean out the air/fuel mixture, which will pick up power, but that *must* be compensated for, or you'll be running too lean, and can get detonation and other problems as well.
In the case of the Lightning, the aftermarket Pro-M MAF's are the exact same size as the factory unit, 80mm!! It's slightly less restrictive because the sampling tube is out of the middle of the main airstream, but there is no power gain in them either, once their full 2-point leanout of A/F is compensated for. The latest unit out for the 2001 Lightning, which some people are retro-fitting to their '99 & '00 Lightnings, is the 90mm unit, and that too, will cause a full 2-point leanout of the A/F ratio, and *must* be compensated for.
The bottom line is that they can be great parts, but they have no place on a basically stock engine, because there is no power gain once their leaning out of the A/F is compensated for.
We only use bigger MAF's & throttle bodies on engines that have been supercharged, or that have had a serious porting job done to the cylinder heads, in other words, engines that have been seriously modified so they can actually benefit from increased airflow capacity in those 2 areas.
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Mike Troyer
Performance Products, Inc.
National Distributor of Superchips
(540) 862-9515
Email: mtroyer@compuserve.com
Performance Products F150Online Superchip ordering system: F150Online Superchip Ordering System
First National F-150 Online Rally Event Organizer
CRS, eh? Too funny! I think most of us are affected by that at one time or another.
Larger aftermarket mass airflow meters can be very beneficial, but not on a basically stock engine. Until the engine has been modified to the point where it's literally capable of out-stripping the flow capacity of the stock MAF & throttle body, you won't see any power gains from increased airflow capacity, and that applies to the Lightning as well. The manufacturers of these parts *know* this, and so what they do to achieve a power gain on a stock or close to stock engine is to lean out the air/fuel mixture, which will pick up power, but that *must* be compensated for, or you'll be running too lean, and can get detonation and other problems as well.
In the case of the Lightning, the aftermarket Pro-M MAF's are the exact same size as the factory unit, 80mm!! It's slightly less restrictive because the sampling tube is out of the middle of the main airstream, but there is no power gain in them either, once their full 2-point leanout of A/F is compensated for. The latest unit out for the 2001 Lightning, which some people are retro-fitting to their '99 & '00 Lightnings, is the 90mm unit, and that too, will cause a full 2-point leanout of the A/F ratio, and *must* be compensated for.
The bottom line is that they can be great parts, but they have no place on a basically stock engine, because there is no power gain once their leaning out of the A/F is compensated for.
We only use bigger MAF's & throttle bodies on engines that have been supercharged, or that have had a serious porting job done to the cylinder heads, in other words, engines that have been seriously modified so they can actually benefit from increased airflow capacity in those 2 areas.
------------------
Mike Troyer
Performance Products, Inc.
National Distributor of Superchips
(540) 862-9515
Email: mtroyer@compuserve.com
Performance Products F150Online Superchip ordering system: F150Online Superchip Ordering System
First National F-150 Online Rally Event Organizer
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
From: Southlake, TX
Mike T.,
As always, you're wealth of knowledge is truly amazing. I do, however, have a follow-on question. You mention that the larger Mass Air Flow sensor has no place on a basically stock engine. I was wondering if you could clarify here. For instance, my current mods include a K&N Gen 2 FIPK, JBA Headers, Flowmaster Force II exhaust system, and of course, the Superchip. Given that this isn't a significant change to the stock engine, would you see any benifit of adding the aftermarket MAF sensor, like the Granatelli unit? Thanks for this and previous help.
SlickWilly
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99 F-150 5.4L 4x2 Supercab Flairside Lariat, Amazon Green 2-tone
Mods: Bed Rails, Ford Bed Liner, K&N FIPK, Flowmaster Force II Exhaust System, JBA Headers, Superchip
As always, you're wealth of knowledge is truly amazing. I do, however, have a follow-on question. You mention that the larger Mass Air Flow sensor has no place on a basically stock engine. I was wondering if you could clarify here. For instance, my current mods include a K&N Gen 2 FIPK, JBA Headers, Flowmaster Force II exhaust system, and of course, the Superchip. Given that this isn't a significant change to the stock engine, would you see any benifit of adding the aftermarket MAF sensor, like the Granatelli unit? Thanks for this and previous help.
SlickWilly
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99 F-150 5.4L 4x2 Supercab Flairside Lariat, Amazon Green 2-tone
Mods: Bed Rails, Ford Bed Liner, K&N FIPK, Flowmaster Force II Exhaust System, JBA Headers, Superchip
Former Sponsor
Joined: Mar 1998
Posts: 13,385
Likes: 4
From: Virginia
Hi Slick,
Basically, your factory MAF has *plenty* of capacity in terms of being able to supply enough airflow into the motor at your level of modifications, and for your stock 19 lb. fuel injector capacity.
It's not that we don't like aftermarket MAF's (mass airflow meters), they're *great* parts, it's just that they have their time & place. For these F-150's, we just don't see it as being a needed device or something that will show a nice return on your investment in terms of power added unless you have either supercharged your engine, or have had the cylinder heads ported, etc., so that the engine's actual airflow *needs* are greater.
It is not until your engine has been modified to the point that it is literally capable of out-stripping the flow capacity of the stock MAF, that you'll see appreciable power gains by increasing the actual airflow capacity of the MAF. The manufacturers of these parts know that, and they now calibrate most of them to lean out the air fuel ratio a bit so that they will show a power gain once installed. And in some cases, if fuel quality is good enough and/or the leanout from the MAF small enough, you can get away with that. However, in most cases that needs to be compensated for by richening back up the a/f, and once that is done, there goes any power gains right back out the window.
So we generally advise not using them unless you are either supercharged or have ported the cylinder heads, so that your engine can actually make use of the additional airflow capacity.
You're fuel injectors will run out of capacity to supply enough fuel well before you'll run out of airflow capacity in the MAF in these vehicles. Neal the HP Freak's vehicle is a good example of that, if you've been keeping up with what Neal has been doing and where his performance is at.
It's up to you, that's just what we suggest, and you;re the only one that has to be happy with what you do to your vehicle, so if you want to install one, that is up to you. If you do, I would advise having us to the custom program update to compensate for its leanout. Anyone who is running an aftermarket MAF with the Superchip who has not had a custom program done to compensate for the aftermarket MAF needs to listen *very* closely for any sounds of detonation (spark knock, "pinging"), especially anytime they're into the throttle significantly.
All of this having been said, there are some of our F-150 customers who have installed those parts and are very happy with them. If you want to use one, that is strictly up to you.
Best of luck whatever you decide,
------------------
Mike Troyer
Performance Products, Inc.
National Distributor of Superchips
(540) 862-9515
Email: mtroyer@compuserve.com
Performance Products F150Online Superchip ordering system: F150Online Superchip Ordering System
National F-150 Online Rally Event Organizer
Basically, your factory MAF has *plenty* of capacity in terms of being able to supply enough airflow into the motor at your level of modifications, and for your stock 19 lb. fuel injector capacity.
It's not that we don't like aftermarket MAF's (mass airflow meters), they're *great* parts, it's just that they have their time & place. For these F-150's, we just don't see it as being a needed device or something that will show a nice return on your investment in terms of power added unless you have either supercharged your engine, or have had the cylinder heads ported, etc., so that the engine's actual airflow *needs* are greater.
It is not until your engine has been modified to the point that it is literally capable of out-stripping the flow capacity of the stock MAF, that you'll see appreciable power gains by increasing the actual airflow capacity of the MAF. The manufacturers of these parts know that, and they now calibrate most of them to lean out the air fuel ratio a bit so that they will show a power gain once installed. And in some cases, if fuel quality is good enough and/or the leanout from the MAF small enough, you can get away with that. However, in most cases that needs to be compensated for by richening back up the a/f, and once that is done, there goes any power gains right back out the window.
So we generally advise not using them unless you are either supercharged or have ported the cylinder heads, so that your engine can actually make use of the additional airflow capacity.
You're fuel injectors will run out of capacity to supply enough fuel well before you'll run out of airflow capacity in the MAF in these vehicles. Neal the HP Freak's vehicle is a good example of that, if you've been keeping up with what Neal has been doing and where his performance is at.
It's up to you, that's just what we suggest, and you;re the only one that has to be happy with what you do to your vehicle, so if you want to install one, that is up to you. If you do, I would advise having us to the custom program update to compensate for its leanout. Anyone who is running an aftermarket MAF with the Superchip who has not had a custom program done to compensate for the aftermarket MAF needs to listen *very* closely for any sounds of detonation (spark knock, "pinging"), especially anytime they're into the throttle significantly.
All of this having been said, there are some of our F-150 customers who have installed those parts and are very happy with them. If you want to use one, that is strictly up to you.
Best of luck whatever you decide,
------------------
Mike Troyer
Performance Products, Inc.
National Distributor of Superchips
(540) 862-9515
Email: mtroyer@compuserve.com
Performance Products F150Online Superchip ordering system: F150Online Superchip Ordering System
National F-150 Online Rally Event Organizer