Mike, Tuner vs Pulleys/Fan Kit
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Senior Member
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From: Triangle Area, NC
Mike, Tuner vs Pulleys/Fan Kit
Mike, did the "Q" get a thumbs up or a thumbs down?
Anyway, after discussing your product line with you, I was wondering if I would be better off with the engine fan kit and under drive pulleys vs the Tuner. Can't do both at the same time, so I wanted your opinion as which should be the next step. Think "towing".
Anyway, after discussing your product line with you, I was wondering if I would be better off with the engine fan kit and under drive pulleys vs the Tuner. Can't do both at the same time, so I wanted your opinion as which should be the next step. Think "towing".
Former Sponsor
Joined: Mar 1998
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From: Virginia
Hi Linetest,
The Q was FANTASTIC!! It's some of the best, if not *the* best pure quality in pork Q that I've ever had, and we can't thank you enough, absolutely EXCELLENT!! The sauce is pretty hot, but very good.
The actual *quality* of the chopped pork amazing, and was what impressed me the most by far, as it was (past tense) simply outstanding, with virtually zero obvious fat, and NO gristle or twine, etc. That is *excellent* Q, to say the least, and that restaurant can be darned proud of their product. No wonder it's MJ's favorite, it certainly gives my traditional favorite Stamey's Q a serious run for the money, to the point that it's a toss-up between the 2, and that's saying something.
We ate it for dinner last night, and truth be told, I started tearing into it as soon as I got back home after we finished your exhaust system installation in fact, as I couldn't wait. (I told you I was a Q fanatic!)
OK, with regard to using "Towing" as the primary need in terms of improving the vehicle's performance, and trying to decide whether to do the Micro Tuner OR the fans & underdrive pulleys............
For your towing needs, I'd say to do the fans & pulleys, as they will give you about 30 more peak HP at the rear wheels *and* help the fuel mileage as well. I'm a real nut about getting a sharp state of tune on the motor first, but when we're talking about towing specifically, then I prefer the parasitic loss-reducing mods for *that* specific purpose.
Normally I'd say to do the Micro Tuner first, as optimizing the powertrain programming will reduce raw acceleration times more than anything else for the same or less cost. But when we're talking about *towing*, where every ounce of torque at *any* throttle position and rpm is critical, reducing the parasitic losses becomes more important than the absolute quickest acceleration times, and I feel will give you more obvious benefit. And long-term, the fans & pulleys will eventually pay for themselves in the added fuel mileage.
Given your specific needs and what's important to you, combined with what you and I discussed privately yesterday, at this point I'd recommend doing the fans & pulleys over the Micro Tuner, for *you*, for right *now*.
Thanks again Ed, it was a pleasure meeting you & talk to you soon!
The Q was FANTASTIC!! It's some of the best, if not *the* best pure quality in pork Q that I've ever had, and we can't thank you enough, absolutely EXCELLENT!! The sauce is pretty hot, but very good.
The actual *quality* of the chopped pork amazing, and was what impressed me the most by far, as it was (past tense) simply outstanding, with virtually zero obvious fat, and NO gristle or twine, etc. That is *excellent* Q, to say the least, and that restaurant can be darned proud of their product. No wonder it's MJ's favorite, it certainly gives my traditional favorite Stamey's Q a serious run for the money, to the point that it's a toss-up between the 2, and that's saying something.
We ate it for dinner last night, and truth be told, I started tearing into it as soon as I got back home after we finished your exhaust system installation in fact, as I couldn't wait. (I told you I was a Q fanatic!)
OK, with regard to using "Towing" as the primary need in terms of improving the vehicle's performance, and trying to decide whether to do the Micro Tuner OR the fans & underdrive pulleys............
For your towing needs, I'd say to do the fans & pulleys, as they will give you about 30 more peak HP at the rear wheels *and* help the fuel mileage as well. I'm a real nut about getting a sharp state of tune on the motor first, but when we're talking about towing specifically, then I prefer the parasitic loss-reducing mods for *that* specific purpose.
Normally I'd say to do the Micro Tuner first, as optimizing the powertrain programming will reduce raw acceleration times more than anything else for the same or less cost. But when we're talking about *towing*, where every ounce of torque at *any* throttle position and rpm is critical, reducing the parasitic losses becomes more important than the absolute quickest acceleration times, and I feel will give you more obvious benefit. And long-term, the fans & pulleys will eventually pay for themselves in the added fuel mileage.
Given your specific needs and what's important to you, combined with what you and I discussed privately yesterday, at this point I'd recommend doing the fans & pulleys over the Micro Tuner, for *you*, for right *now*.
Thanks again Ed, it was a pleasure meeting you & talk to you soon!
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From: Triangle Area, NC
I was nervous. It wasn't Stamey's, so I was taking a risk! Whew!
I appreciate your time yesterday, and pass my thanks onto the crew at Fast Lane. They take pride in their work, it shows.
The main reason I had the eye on the tuner was to firm up the shifts, reducing tranny temps I assume. Tranny longevity is debatable with the F-150, especially under load, so I was thinking that first.
However...
Another trip your way is under consideration. I may trade the tuner and the TB cover purchase for the pulley/fan install.
Kind of a Troyer Stage 1.585 performance upgrade I guess.
Normally this would peeve the wife, but she was excited about the gig you did at Chincoteaugue and wants to know what years you played.
I'll have to check my checkbook, and I appreciate your advice. Very valuable. I'll be in touch.
Thanks again.
Ed
I appreciate your time yesterday, and pass my thanks onto the crew at Fast Lane. They take pride in their work, it shows.
The main reason I had the eye on the tuner was to firm up the shifts, reducing tranny temps I assume. Tranny longevity is debatable with the F-150, especially under load, so I was thinking that first.
However...
Another trip your way is under consideration. I may trade the tuner and the TB cover purchase for the pulley/fan install.
Kind of a Troyer Stage 1.585 performance upgrade I guess.
Normally this would peeve the wife, but she was excited about the gig you did at Chincoteaugue and wants to know what years you played.
I'll have to check my checkbook, and I appreciate your advice. Very valuable. I'll be in touch.
Thanks again.
Ed
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Joined: Mar 1998
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From: Virginia
Hi Ed,
Yes, I'd agree that the tranny needs help for towing, reducing slippage and giving it more fluid volume to engage the Overdrive band quicker will help extend it's lifespan. The Micro Tuner will help with that, the best case scenario would be the Micro Tuner *and* a Transgo shift kit in there setup on Level 2. That way you'd have both the mechanical and the software aspects of the transmission's operation taken care of. Take care of the various delays & retards, etc., in the program, and then take care of allowing the transmission to be physically capable of flowing more fluid *volume* via the mechanical mod, I.E., the Transgo shift kit.
You know, if we keep this up, we'll get the differential, brakes & suspension involved in all this as well, so it's important to get focused on what's a priority, and some of this may be a tough choice for you in terms of exactly which to do first...........
In terms of what benefits towing performance the most, I prefer doing the mods to reduce those parasitic losses. The tranny still should have some help, in fact, we'd like to see the Micro Tuner, and the shift kit on every one of these trucks that is towing, as we know just how much that helps their lifespan. But of course, it's not our money being spent, so the vehicle owner has to decide which is their first priority.
To aid towing *performance* the best, the fans & pulleys is the trick. If you want to take measures to help the transmission first, that's perfectly fine, and sooner or later that should be addressed in order to get the best possible service life.
You'll need to give it some thought of course, and decide which is the most important priority for you. Feel free to call us on this anytime, as always.
Oh, the years we played at the running of the ponies on the Eastern Shore were roughly from the mid to late 80's, with one or two in the early 90's. I cracked up to find someone else who knew of that (TPP) restaurant! It was a relatively fat gig in that we only had to play 2 simple 30 minute sets, one before & one after, and then everything folded up by about 9 pm or so. I think the annual running of the ponies is about the only time the sidewalks aren't rolled up at 5 pm out there! The whole event was/is done thru that volunteer fire dept. out there, if memory serves, as I think that is their primary source of revenue for operations.
Yes, I'd agree that the tranny needs help for towing, reducing slippage and giving it more fluid volume to engage the Overdrive band quicker will help extend it's lifespan. The Micro Tuner will help with that, the best case scenario would be the Micro Tuner *and* a Transgo shift kit in there setup on Level 2. That way you'd have both the mechanical and the software aspects of the transmission's operation taken care of. Take care of the various delays & retards, etc., in the program, and then take care of allowing the transmission to be physically capable of flowing more fluid *volume* via the mechanical mod, I.E., the Transgo shift kit.
You know, if we keep this up, we'll get the differential, brakes & suspension involved in all this as well, so it's important to get focused on what's a priority, and some of this may be a tough choice for you in terms of exactly which to do first...........
In terms of what benefits towing performance the most, I prefer doing the mods to reduce those parasitic losses. The tranny still should have some help, in fact, we'd like to see the Micro Tuner, and the shift kit on every one of these trucks that is towing, as we know just how much that helps their lifespan. But of course, it's not our money being spent, so the vehicle owner has to decide which is their first priority.
To aid towing *performance* the best, the fans & pulleys is the trick. If you want to take measures to help the transmission first, that's perfectly fine, and sooner or later that should be addressed in order to get the best possible service life.
You'll need to give it some thought of course, and decide which is the most important priority for you. Feel free to call us on this anytime, as always.
Oh, the years we played at the running of the ponies on the Eastern Shore were roughly from the mid to late 80's, with one or two in the early 90's. I cracked up to find someone else who knew of that (TPP) restaurant! It was a relatively fat gig in that we only had to play 2 simple 30 minute sets, one before & one after, and then everything folded up by about 9 pm or so. I think the annual running of the ponies is about the only time the sidewalks aren't rolled up at 5 pm out there! The whole event was/is done thru that volunteer fire dept. out there, if memory serves, as I think that is their primary source of revenue for operations.
Former Sponsor
Joined: Mar 1998
Posts: 13,385
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From: Virginia
Hi Ed,
By all means please do take your time, there's no rush in any of this & we'll be happy to help as best we can with regard to how we view the various "priorities," etc. for how you're using the vehicle.
Obviously there are a number of things to consider, and if you'd like to, at some point, feel free to give us a call & we can talk about just how much weight you're towing, how often, how far, etc. That data should also be looked at, I.E., occasionally towing 2500 lbs 10-20 miles a few times a year is much different than towing 3500-4000 lbs. a few hundred miles a couple times a month, or towing 5500 lbs. for 2 weeks every summer for vacation, will there be any towing over mountains, etc. You know, there's towing and then there's TOWING. You'll most likely want to give that data some additional consideration in thinking all of this over & pondering whether you actually want to do more mods, and if so, exactly which are the most important priorities to you & just how the vehicle will be used.
Have fun with that beautiful new SuperCrew & hope your wife likes the exhaust!
By all means please do take your time, there's no rush in any of this & we'll be happy to help as best we can with regard to how we view the various "priorities," etc. for how you're using the vehicle.
Obviously there are a number of things to consider, and if you'd like to, at some point, feel free to give us a call & we can talk about just how much weight you're towing, how often, how far, etc. That data should also be looked at, I.E., occasionally towing 2500 lbs 10-20 miles a few times a year is much different than towing 3500-4000 lbs. a few hundred miles a couple times a month, or towing 5500 lbs. for 2 weeks every summer for vacation, will there be any towing over mountains, etc. You know, there's towing and then there's TOWING.
You'll most likely want to give that data some additional consideration in thinking all of this over & pondering whether you actually want to do more mods, and if so, exactly which are the most important priorities to you & just how the vehicle will be used.Have fun with that beautiful new SuperCrew & hope your wife likes the exhaust!
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Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2001
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From: Triangle Area, NC
Now going off topic......
From Mrs. Linetest (Laura)
Mike,
I just wanted to let you know, I was the one that "introduced"
Ed to Chincoteage.
When I was a kid, my grandfather took my brother and I there EVERY year, as a matter of fact, I used to help him sell raffle tickets for the first colt to hit the shore, the day of the swim, we would be on a old red pickup at the swim site and than on the bandstand at the carnival grounds. I loved it.
You are absolutly correct, the volunteer fire dept. does this every year, and a good portion of the money raised actually goes back to the fire dept. to "care" for the horses year round, which includes vet bills, feeding (during bad weather months).
The "Wild" Ponies actually "belong" to the fire dept. so to speak, and the do a GREAT job at caring for these ponies.
I was very disappointed when Ed told me Pony Pines had been sold, and would possibly be demolished, as he told you Ed and I were married in that restaurant.
When Ed told me you knew about Chincoteague Va, I thought he was pulling my leg, as "nobody" knows about Chincoteague
Laura
Mike,
I just wanted to let you know, I was the one that "introduced"
Ed to Chincoteage.
When I was a kid, my grandfather took my brother and I there EVERY year, as a matter of fact, I used to help him sell raffle tickets for the first colt to hit the shore, the day of the swim, we would be on a old red pickup at the swim site and than on the bandstand at the carnival grounds. I loved it.
You are absolutly correct, the volunteer fire dept. does this every year, and a good portion of the money raised actually goes back to the fire dept. to "care" for the horses year round, which includes vet bills, feeding (during bad weather months).
The "Wild" Ponies actually "belong" to the fire dept. so to speak, and the do a GREAT job at caring for these ponies.
I was very disappointed when Ed told me Pony Pines had been sold, and would possibly be demolished, as he told you Ed and I were married in that restaurant.
When Ed told me you knew about Chincoteague Va, I thought he was pulling my leg, as "nobody" knows about Chincoteague
Laura
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From: Virginia
Hi Laura,
So sweet of you to post, thanks!!
I grinned from ear to ear (well, more like busted out laughing in glee) when Ed told me you were married in the Pony Pines. I can't tell you how many times we ate there, it was the only real place to eat for us & of course had great seafood.
I loved and hated playing that gig, as it was an easy gig for decent money, just 2 quick 30 minute sets, but there was *nothing* to do there unless you could enjoy the water. Most musicians don't get up until the crack of 4 pm or so, thus we didn't spend much time in the water or on the beach. Too many horse apples from all the wild (tame) ponies!
It's so nice to run into someone else that knows about that area of the Eastern Shore, and their Fire Dept. just does a *wonderful* job of taking care of those ponies, it's such a great Virginia tradition & they deserve high praise.
Laura, thanks ever so much for dropping by to make a post, & hope to talk with yo again & maybe meet some day. If Ed decides to come back up here sometime, my wife & I must take you & Ed out to a nice dinner. We finished off that *GREAT* Q Ed brought up to us just last night, it never stood a chance around here!
Take care,
So sweet of you to post, thanks!!
I grinned from ear to ear (well, more like busted out laughing in glee) when Ed told me you were married in the Pony Pines. I can't tell you how many times we ate there, it was the only real place to eat for us & of course had great seafood.
I loved and hated playing that gig, as it was an easy gig for decent money, just 2 quick 30 minute sets, but there was *nothing* to do there unless you could enjoy the water. Most musicians don't get up until the crack of 4 pm or so, thus we didn't spend much time in the water or on the beach. Too many horse apples from all the wild (tame) ponies!
It's so nice to run into someone else that knows about that area of the Eastern Shore, and their Fire Dept. just does a *wonderful* job of taking care of those ponies, it's such a great Virginia tradition & they deserve high praise.
Laura, thanks ever so much for dropping by to make a post, & hope to talk with yo again & maybe meet some day. If Ed decides to come back up here sometime, my wife & I must take you & Ed out to a nice dinner. We finished off that *GREAT* Q Ed brought up to us just last night, it never stood a chance around here!
Take care,
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 345
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From: Waterloo, IA
Here's another scenario for you Mike...
Think Bank-for-the-Buck!
I put about 25,000 miles of mixed daily driving on my truck (see sig) per year. I recently purchased a bumper-pull horse trailer (3000# empty, 4500-6000# loaded) that I intend to tow at least 2000 miles per year. I am planning a trip in late September from Iowa to Nevada with at least 1 horse, 4 dogs, and all of the gear for a weeks stay, and I thought that I might benefit from a few mods.
I was thinking Flip-Chip and Magna Flow exhaust, but this thread got me thinking about electric fans and exhaust. I'm not thrilled about the under-drive pully and electric fan combo because of the few times that I have been caught in traffic on 90+ degree days. The last time that I was out West, I noticed that the 91-92 octane fuel was at least $.20-.30 more than the 85-87 octane and with such a small fuel tank I thought that I would be lucky to find the high octane fuel every 200 miles.
I'm starting to wonder if I'm under-trucked, but I would hate to have to drive a V-10 F-250 all year for the 2000-3000 miles of towing. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
I put about 25,000 miles of mixed daily driving on my truck (see sig) per year. I recently purchased a bumper-pull horse trailer (3000# empty, 4500-6000# loaded) that I intend to tow at least 2000 miles per year. I am planning a trip in late September from Iowa to Nevada with at least 1 horse, 4 dogs, and all of the gear for a weeks stay, and I thought that I might benefit from a few mods.
I was thinking Flip-Chip and Magna Flow exhaust, but this thread got me thinking about electric fans and exhaust. I'm not thrilled about the under-drive pully and electric fan combo because of the few times that I have been caught in traffic on 90+ degree days. The last time that I was out West, I noticed that the 91-92 octane fuel was at least $.20-.30 more than the 85-87 octane and with such a small fuel tank I thought that I would be lucky to find the high octane fuel every 200 miles.
I'm starting to wonder if I'm under-trucked, but I would hate to have to drive a V-10 F-250 all year for the 2000-3000 miles of towing. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
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Joined: Mar 1998
Posts: 13,385
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From: Virginia
Hi Opie,
It's been a little while.
I need to remind everyone that in general, anything detailed like this really needs to be handled by calling us, as we just don't have the time to read long detailed posts & review signatures, then type out a detailed response etc. It takes literally 100-200 times longer to sit here typing it all out compared to doing on the phone, that's why we've always said we can't get into details here.
Briefly.....................
If the vehicle is stock or maybe just has an intake kit already on it, then getting the powertrain programming optimized and getting the exhaust flowing would be the first couple of things I would do, so I think you're on the right track there & I would not change that. Then *next* I would do the electric fans and underdrive pulleys, which are great mods for towing, but they do not override the "basics" of good tuning & getting the motor breathing better.
Now keep in mind, what I've said here is just how I feel, and is in no way required or mandatory. You could certainly choose to hold on the chip and the exhaust and decide do the fans & pulleys first. It's really a matter of what you feel *your* priorities are.
Bang for the buck would be to do the chip and the exhaust first, and *then* do the electric fans & underdrive pulleys. The optimized powertrain program alone will make as much difference in 1/4 mile ET as the fans & pulleys combined, even though the chip won't gain as much raw power as both the fans & pulleys combined. All the other aspects of the powertrain program that are improved allow further improvements in acceleration times beyond what the straight math & HP numbers would tell you on paper, so bang for the buck would be the chip and exhaust, *then* the fans & pulleys.
I am really hot about doing the fans & pulleys simply because combined, you're looking at the better part of 30 hp (and sometimes a bit more) at the real wheels, and some nice mpg gains can be had as well, a real win-win scenario. I do feel that the tuning, intake & exhaust should be done first, but there are some people who want to wait on doing a chip or tuner, or who just don't want to start using premium gas for example, and instead will decide to do the fans & pulleys. It's all good.
Have fun & give us a call if you'd like to go over any of this,
It's been a little while.
I need to remind everyone that in general, anything detailed like this really needs to be handled by calling us, as we just don't have the time to read long detailed posts & review signatures, then type out a detailed response etc. It takes literally 100-200 times longer to sit here typing it all out compared to doing on the phone, that's why we've always said we can't get into details here.
Briefly.....................
If the vehicle is stock or maybe just has an intake kit already on it, then getting the powertrain programming optimized and getting the exhaust flowing would be the first couple of things I would do, so I think you're on the right track there & I would not change that. Then *next* I would do the electric fans and underdrive pulleys, which are great mods for towing, but they do not override the "basics" of good tuning & getting the motor breathing better.
Now keep in mind, what I've said here is just how I feel, and is in no way required or mandatory. You could certainly choose to hold on the chip and the exhaust and decide do the fans & pulleys first. It's really a matter of what you feel *your* priorities are.
Bang for the buck would be to do the chip and the exhaust first, and *then* do the electric fans & underdrive pulleys. The optimized powertrain program alone will make as much difference in 1/4 mile ET as the fans & pulleys combined, even though the chip won't gain as much raw power as both the fans & pulleys combined. All the other aspects of the powertrain program that are improved allow further improvements in acceleration times beyond what the straight math & HP numbers would tell you on paper, so bang for the buck would be the chip and exhaust, *then* the fans & pulleys.
I am really hot about doing the fans & pulleys simply because combined, you're looking at the better part of 30 hp (and sometimes a bit more) at the real wheels, and some nice mpg gains can be had as well, a real win-win scenario. I do feel that the tuning, intake & exhaust should be done first, but there are some people who want to wait on doing a chip or tuner, or who just don't want to start using premium gas for example, and instead will decide to do the fans & pulleys. It's all good.
Have fun & give us a call if you'd like to go over any of this,