Engine Guru's - Why shouldn't I go old school?
 

Ok, I've been thinking. Dangerous, I know but here's the deal.

I have been considering a "built" engine for my HD. I'm quite impressed with some of the Turbo engines.
No problem there you might think but is a Triton engine my best choice?
We all know that even once you do the built bottom end that you still have a fairly unimpressive rod ratio and the complexity of the overhead cams etc.
What's to stop me building a stroked 302 (to 331) Windsor or even a 351 for the added cubes and then adding aftermarket turbos and EFI like FAST?
In my mind, the Triton in its n/a form (260hp) offers no real advantage over and old pushrod motor. It's certainly more complex and a lot wider too.
Probably cost more to build as well especially over this side of the pond when it comes to aftermarket parts like stroker cranks and decent flowing heads.
I can live with low tech pushrods if it means that I can have a stronger faster engine.
Hey, I'd even put a Flathead in if it went fast :D
I'm pretty sure that the Windsor can be adapted to the 4100R and with the smaller dimensions, leaves more room for the turbo's and plumbing.

So, am I barking up the wrong tree entirely here?

Discuss.

To each thier own I suppose.

Personally I feel the modular motors are significanty more efficient and can stand up to higher power outputs in stock form.

If your talking a full on race motor then the cost and experience in building a sbf would win out at this point in time.

If you want to stick with the 5.4L I'd suggest getting one of the aluminum blocks, a destroked crank, 4V heads, and turbo. That combo could rev higher and make some serious power.

Rich

Just get a 2005 Ford GT engine! :coffee:

The old school plan would work out great IMHO. Twin turbo 408??? :bows:

One thing to consider - you'd have to rework all your gauges. They work great with the factory PCM/fuel system but won't interface easily with old school or aftermarket EFI systems. That would definitely add some $$ to your project.

i don't know what the emission laws are over there, but here you really aren't allowed to put an older motor into newer vehicle

302 blocks like to split in half around 550hp

With the 5.4L, and a few bolt on you can get 550hp no problem (at the flywheel)

Then there is the transmission to consider, a new driveshaft, new mounting brackets and cross members, engine mounts, Completely new exhaust with custom headers. not to mention all the custom fabrication that needs to be done.

Then again, you could pick up a gen 1 and build it for the price of what you are considering doing to the Gen 2.

It's much cheaper to buy a JLP short block and throw some heads on it and be done with it.

I know somone with a nitrous'd 514 big block in a 99' L. The 5.4 offers no real advantage over a pushrod engine, other than the fact that it came in the truck. Personally, I think the 5.4 kinda sucks. Crappy bore size (even sleeved) and even crappier heads (even ported), extremely heavy for its displacement, among other things. OHC engines have been around for more than 60 years, so they're not really a new step foward. IMHO the cam in block arrangement offers more advantages.

1. Won't fit - too wide

2. Requires many other oil system parts beyond the engine for the dry sump system

3. Requires a special control system - it utilizes dual injectors and thus needs another set of injector drivers and probably wouldn't interface properly with the standard gauges

4. Uses a front entry, high flow water pump that would probably blow the hoses off the L cooling system

5. The block is not machined to accept the starter in the stock location

6. The blower brings air in from the rear - you'll have to hack out some sheet metal and maybe rework your wiper system to route air back there

It's a sweat engine capable of monster power but it really only works in one car...

If pasing emissions is of no concern, I'd say there's absolutely no downside. As you pointed out, the Triton is way more "complex" and certainly more expensive to mod. With all the money/time you'd save by building a n/a Windsor, you can easily handle the new motor/trans mounts, etc.

I'd love to see someone do this. Actually, I'd like so see someone do a 429 with a gigantic roots blower and bug catcher scoop sticking out of the hood.

How do you figure it's too wide?

Emmisions wouldn't be a problem as long as it passed the sniffer test for the year of vehicle and had cats (mandatory).
We have no restriction on swapping older engines into newer vehicles.

Check out this article in Hot Rod magazine. 331 ci, single turbo and 940 hp on race gas.
Ok, $20,000 for a turnkey engine is a bit steep but you get the general idea.

How about a 351 ci detuned to a nice 750hp on pump gas?

Bennett 331 ci Turbo

The GT motor is significantly wider. It'll fit.. but you have to move things on the drivers / front area in the engine room. Not to mention coming up with a totally different lower intake.

Rich

"I'd like so see someone do a 429 with a gigantic roots blower and bug catcher scoop sticking out of the hood."

My dream when my motor goes. :thumbsup:

If a Navigator 32v engine fits, so will the gt engine.
The stock GT computer will run it fine in the lightning
the oil system comes with the crate engine.

A stock Gt engine, with a tune on it and racing fuel can put out over 700hp. Now, do some work on the heads, and maybe port the blower...

Also, the Stock blower will not fit in a lightning, it is much too long, But if you put a whipple 3.3 on it, it fits nicely.

Heck Adam you love the complicated life eh?

See you on the other side.


Ricki ( "The Munch" )