The question I have about tuners and chips is, They claim to give you the ability for more firm shifts. How is this acomplished? My fear is that it doesn't leave the clutches engaged long enough and to properly/smoothly shift. I don't know a whole lot about transmissions but I can't imagine SLAMMING thru the gears on a regular basis is good for it. Everything else about the tuners/chip sounds great, I just don't want to blow my tranny and warranty, I don't realy buy that you can deinstall a program without any trace of it at the dealer. Plus that would be very dishonest

 

Try this

The answers to those questions are already posted in this forum in detail.

 

Under what do I search? I had already used it and did not come up with the answer I was looking for as to wether it will cause harm under repeated hard use. The best I can come up with so far is that the firmness is progressive to throttle input.

 

F150online Forums > Search > Thread Results for: Shift Firmness

Try looking through some of these posts and concentrate on the ones posted by “Superchips Distributor” Mike can explain about the shift firmness the best.

 

Thanks, I'll have to keep digging.

 

You don't have to have a setting that "Slams through the gears".
The change in the program adjusts the internal pump pressure and the electric solenoid operational timing.
My opinion is, the better way to change shifting is with an internal valve body modification that does not rely solely on just raising pump pressure through programming.
Just raising pump pressure will some day result in earlier internal leakage from the higher pressure due to wear and aging, than valve body changes that use near stock pressure levels.
This is just my position based on research between the two methods.
Program changes are very convienent and clean and tend to allow people to keep playing with the shift points using a programable unt.
There is an old saying that says 'you play-you pay'.
Kidding aside, the trans life can be improved with firmer shorter duration shifting over stock operation that does not have to jerk your head off.

 

Your best bet is to talk to Gregg Evens (goes by Factor tech I believe on this board) who is an expert in Ford transmissions. I do know that for the transmission in the Lightning’s, the 4R100 it is NOT good and WILL cause damage to the transmission by changing the line pressure. By changing the line pressures in the 4R100 it can let the pump run dry for milliseconds which WILL cause major damage.

A valve body is the best and safest way of changing shift firmness. It is true that with firmer shifts you prolong the life of the transmission because the shift duration is shorter and thus less friction and heat. Gregg Evens is the person who designed the FTVB (Factory Tech Valve Body) that the vast majority of Lightning owners use when wanting to improve and firm their shift firmness.

Don’t take me the wrong way, a chip or programmer is a great device to use for more horsepower, but in my opinion, they are NOT safe for dealing with shift firmness and could cost you thousands of dollars in transmission repairs in the future…

 

Jersey

I'm no expert here, but my understanding of stock versus Superchip modified tranmission shifts is the following.

With stock shifting after the clutches fill with oil the clutch is programmed to slip, giving the driver the feel of a smooth shift. It is important to understand the smooth shift is a result of the clutch slipping. The second feature of stock shifting is the pcm is programmed in many cases for a slight delay in applying power, so even with the hammer down, the computer tells the engine to delay. So with stock shifting you get smooth slipping shifts and of course the slipping clutches produce heat - a real enemy of auto trannys.

With Superchips, yes the line pressure is increased, but the delays in the program are also removed. So, here shifts are faster or firmer because the clutches are slipping less and the delays are removed. This could and should actually increase tranny life since less heat is produced.

Of course we are not talking about increased life when trucks are constantly run hard from stop light to stop light. If one races their truck constantly, it will over time likely have racing type failures -- and I run my truck hard -- and really, really enjoy it!!!!

Best of luck.

enb

 

Just want to clarify that I could be wrong about the other transmission and the only one I have done a lot of research on is the 4R100 in the Lightning.

Mike will NOT steer you wrong. He has never mislead anyone to make a buck so hopefully Mike will come along and tell you I am wrong about the other transmission and changing the line pressure.

The Lightning transmission is already running at 90% efficiency on a stock motor, it is a beefed up F-250 transmission, and that is one reason changing line pressure on the 4R100 is a transmission death wish.

 

01 XLT

I believe one reason to use the valve body upgrade on the 4r100L tranny is this:

I think that when Lightning motors are modified for more power we run into the problem where the engine actually gains rpms (power) faster than the clutches into the stock transmission can fill with oil and then shift, so the engine "bounces" off the rev limiter while 'waiting' for the transmission to 'catch up'. I wish I had this problem, by the way.

So the fix is two-fold I think. First, to install the mechanical valving upgrade to allow the clutches to fill faster just as you described. Second, to custom tune the tranny to send the signal to shift sooner so engine isn't bouncing off the rev limiter, which would be done through Superchips / Troyer custom tuning for example.

This explanation is rudimentary, at best.

I have enjoyed your input here for the very short time I have been following these forums. There is so much information here that one could read for hours, if they had the time. Thank you for your contribution.


enb

 

Hi jersey 51,

First, you shouldn't just lump all "tuners and chips" into the same category, that's a mistake - there are some companies out there who are indeed doing things they should have their heads examined over - some of the things we see certain chipmakers & "tuners" doing tells us they really don't have a clue as to what can and cannot safely be done. On the other hand, there are indeed very reputable & expert companies out there doing a very good job in this regard - so there is quite a bit of variance among all the various devices.

There are many people willing to express "opinions," but few people who actually have thorough knowledge of specific automatic transmissions and calibration, and modification of both and the results of all of that - yet there is never any shortage of opinions, especially out on the Internet. Heck, even some of those who have extensive tear-down experience at various automakers I've seen make some statements & recommendations I don't agree with at all (and no, I do NOT mean to denigrate anyone posting in this current thread or anyone else specifically, nor will I even remotely participate in a debate, argument, etc., over any of this), and probably plenty of people who may not agree with what I think!

Just speaking in general - it depends on just how firm you are trying to make the shifts, and on what transmission, and in what vehicle, with what modifications, etc., etc - for example, in the 4R100's, it's a bad idea to try to make the shifts firm enough via calibration alone to chirp the tires on a heavy-throttle upshift, as the stock 4R100 simply cannot fill the oncoming clutch quick enough to prevent burning the clutches during a heavier-throttle upshift - the 4R100 in the SVT Lightning is an excellent example of that. To do that in the 4R100 in a truck requires proper *mechanical* modifications, but then exactly *what* type of mechanical change you make will also affect the calibration changes that will also be required - sometimes drastically! I see some people advocating mechanical changes only, who do not realize that in many cases, if you make a mechanical change inside the tranny there will be calibration changes needed as well.

For those who want consistent tire-chirping upshifts in the 2003 & earlier F-150's, we recommend also doing a mechanical modification modifications (either the Transgo shift kit or the FTVB) to the transmission combined with calibration changes - it's not just about *pressure*, it's really about more fluid *volume* without resorting to high static pressures, and thus fill the oncoming clutch much quicker to effect the tire-chirping upshift at full-throttle - if that is what is desired.

Now in the 4R75-E, it's a bit of a different animal and responds *far* differently to calibration changes compared to the 4R70W's, though many people in the industry think it's to be treated just like a 4R70W - which is dead wrong.

It also depends on just what type of vehicle and for what type of operating conditions we're talking about - remember, factory calibrations (and mechanical configurations) are almost always heavily compromised based on what the automakers think will provide them with the largest number of new vehicle sales - not what will make the transmission last the longest, or what will make each driver happy given how they use their vehicle, etc. This is where multiple-program *custom* tuning comes in, and why so many people come to us for that work, as we have specialized in the F-150 platform for many years.

There is far more to this than could ever be covered here - the bottom line is you need to talk with whoever is actually doing the tuning *IF* you are having a custom tune done - and what will get you the best results in these trucks is to have us do our custom tuning. Now if you are just going to use something like a "standard" 1714 or 1715 Superchips Micro Tuner, then just take the "default" or "Superchips" settings for the shift firmness levels and that will be OK in the 4R70W's & 4R75-E's.

The hot tip is to simply give us a call at our number listed below to discuss this in proper detail so you will know exactly what can and what cannot be done safely long-term with regard specifically to shift firmness levels in any F-series platform vehicle with a specific transmission, as well as what tuning will actually do the best job for who you use your vehicle and what your preferences are, etc.

I hope this quick and very generalized info helps your perspective just a bit, feel free to call us if you really want to go over this appropriately, & best of luck whatever you decide!

 

Mike,

Thanks for the excellent information once again. That is interesting you state that the 4R100 with an FTVB should have some type of software change as well, or calibration. Personally I have not yet purchased an FTVB basically because of not feeling completely comfortable with what I read.

To further explain, I hear the FTVB is a great modification that will actually help the transmission due to reducing heat and friction. However, what has me a bit concerned is hearing about nice “firm” shifts that chirp the tires. Therein lays my concern.

Question, if shifts are so firm that that can chirp tires just how hard is that on the rest of the drive train. Granted it may be fine for the actual transmission, but what about U-joints and the gears in the rear-end?

That is my concern and the main reason I have not yet done the FTVB modification to my Lightning 4R100.

My other question, if you have the time to answer, is basically what kind of calibration, or software modifications do you need to do because of the FTVB. More specifically, if down the line I purchased an FTVB and then an XcalibratorI or II is that something that is standard in a “custom tune” you would provide?

Personally, I am not looking at adding big horsepower to my truck but rather would like an FTVB if it truly is better for the transmission. The same would be true about an XcalibratorII when they come out. Not looking for big performance gains as much as a nice tool for data logging and possibly a code reader but a program that might, for the lack of a better description, spice up the factory program but stay in a nice safe zone.

 

The FTVB (Factory Tech Valve Body) is an awesome mod for these Lightnings and or F150's. The way it's set up is the more throttle you give it, the harder it shifts. During light throttle, the trans shifts firm but not harsh. Faster shifts are a good thing and the FTVB does it in the proper way and your trans will last longer. Hope this helps.

Raleigh

 

Hi 01 XLT Sport,

Good to "see" you again!

With the FTVB, a shift kit, or a LMV there are always things we do differently in the transmissions calibration compared to the calibration we do in a custom tune if the transmissions were completely stock - as is appropriate, of course.

Now in the Lightning 4R100's for example, there are 3 different models of FTVB (2c, 4c & 2CR) - and of those 3, we prefer the 2C as it's the most flexible of the 3 models of FTVB calibration-wise, and thus is most appropriate for street driven vehicles.

In the 4R70W, the FTVB also allows us to provide better performance, but once again we do need to do things differently in the tranny calibration because of it's use - in other words, it's always appropriate for us to do a different transmission calibration if a shift kit, FTVB, etc., is installed in the transmission **compared to what we do in our calibrations for completely stock transmissions**.

With regard specifically to having a "tire-chirping" **WOT** (Wide-Open Throttle) 1-2 upshift, in those trucks there is not an inordinate concern with regard to ujoints, etc., as the slipping of the tires at full-throttle allows the release of "energy" so those components don't' take the brunt of that. Now of course you don't set it up on an otherwise stock tranny so that it chirps the tires on light-throttle, here we're talking about full-throttle only, and only on the 1-2.

On the other hand, if you have a Lightning that is being drag raced with slicks and the TQR is removed, you will have more wear on the clutches over time (usually in direct correlation to how many passes the truck makes) due to them taking the brunt (especially with a stock torque converter) as opposed to the tires being able to slip a bit on the 1-2 gear change and thus release a good bit of that energy. Now we generally don't see Ujoints failing more rapidly or driveshafts failing more frequently due to that, as long as there is no wheel hop - I.E., the rear suspension is set up properly for drag racing, so it hooks without wheel hop, etc. We will see a bit more wear on the clutches in the rear differential in that same scenario where when you're drag racing a Lightning with slicks on a track that is hooking - but we generally don't see ujoints or driveshafts breaking as long as wheel hop isn't present. As always, if you're actually racing just about any vehicle at the track, sure, there will be more wear & tear on any number of components in general - that's racing.

That's just a real quick FYI on a couple basics in that regard - to go over this in more detail please feel free to give us a call, OK?