05 5.4 cam phasers not locking at idle @ operating tem
#1
07-13-2015, 01:38 PM
05 5.4 cam phasers not locking at idle @ operating tem
So after hours of reading tons of threads, and info I've come to the conclusion that after my truck is hot (15 min at least of operating temperature), at 800 rpms on deceleration, my cam phaser pins are not locking when it goes to idle, and the motor sounds like its a diesel truck and completely off timing.
Background: I bought the truck with a broken timing chain guide, probably do to oil pressure issue. My buddy installed new dorman phasers, solenoids, and a ebay timing chain, guides and tensionser kit from mizzuno (spelling) seller brand. We got the motor together, and it runs great, until the motor gets to operating temperature. I was told when the oil thins out, there is not enough pressure to work the phasers as they should.
Testing: It happened all the time even rolling to a stop with 5w-20, so I tried 10w-40, which reduced the incidences, but still acts up. My current test try, I went with 15w-40 as a test and am running that right now. It only does it when I reach 800-1000 rpm after being at operating temperature for a while, especially when backing up or rolling forward at a stop sign, then diesels and chugs, and either idles like **** at 500 rpm or dies. I can neutral drop and rev the engine, and it goes back to normal. I even swapped in the old solenoids, with same results. While testing, I unplugged 1 of either side, or both solenoids, and the truck ran PERFECT.
Possible problems still? I've read that maybe there is a leaky seal behind the phasers, dying oil pump, bad bearing somewhere causing lower oil pressure, or bad phasers and or solenoids, which I doubt because they are brand new.
If anyone has/had this problem and got it resolved, I'd like to hear. Also was thinking, if I added an oil cooler, that might help keep the oil thicker at operating temp, and keep the pressure up so this won't happen?
Background: I bought the truck with a broken timing chain guide, probably do to oil pressure issue. My buddy installed new dorman phasers, solenoids, and a ebay timing chain, guides and tensionser kit from mizzuno (spelling) seller brand. We got the motor together, and it runs great, until the motor gets to operating temperature. I was told when the oil thins out, there is not enough pressure to work the phasers as they should.
Testing: It happened all the time even rolling to a stop with 5w-20, so I tried 10w-40, which reduced the incidences, but still acts up. My current test try, I went with 15w-40 as a test and am running that right now. It only does it when I reach 800-1000 rpm after being at operating temperature for a while, especially when backing up or rolling forward at a stop sign, then diesels and chugs, and either idles like **** at 500 rpm or dies. I can neutral drop and rev the engine, and it goes back to normal. I even swapped in the old solenoids, with same results. While testing, I unplugged 1 of either side, or both solenoids, and the truck ran PERFECT.
Possible problems still? I've read that maybe there is a leaky seal behind the phasers, dying oil pump, bad bearing somewhere causing lower oil pressure, or bad phasers and or solenoids, which I doubt because they are brand new.
If anyone has/had this problem and got it resolved, I'd like to hear. Also was thinking, if I added an oil cooler, that might help keep the oil thicker at operating temp, and keep the pressure up so this won't happen?
#2
07-13-2015, 01:59 PM
Read this on another forum...
I see a lot of techs who do the timing chain job on these engines without pulling the oil pan. The crankshaft is an integral part of the valve timing system, (as well as the rest of the engine). The oil pump and oil pickup screen are also an integral part of the VVT system. The 5.4 has a bad habit of destroying the crankshaft thrust shims allowing the crankshaft to travel horizontally within the engine block and rubbing up against the block, the oil pump, or both. A technician should be very careful not to give clients estimates until they pull the oil pan to give the client a proper estimate. A crankshaft drifting forward and backwards in the block will surely break a tensioner rail. The tech who offers to replace that rail along with chains, tensioners, phazers, a valve job a water pump and a bunch of labor is quickly disappointed when he fires up the cars and hears the noises from the broken crank shims. This is not a bad engine. it is an engine with a lubrication flaw with the crankshaft thrustbearings that causes a lot of problems. Almost every engine the machine shop sees with timing chain problems seems to start at thecrankshaft thrust bearings allowing a loss of oil pressure. Fix the crank shims. use motorcraftoil and filters, use a little prolong, and you will get 300,000 miles. Not doing these things will have VERY BAD results. I hope this helps.
I see a lot of techs who do the timing chain job on these engines without pulling the oil pan. The crankshaft is an integral part of the valve timing system, (as well as the rest of the engine). The oil pump and oil pickup screen are also an integral part of the VVT system. The 5.4 has a bad habit of destroying the crankshaft thrust shims allowing the crankshaft to travel horizontally within the engine block and rubbing up against the block, the oil pump, or both. A technician should be very careful not to give clients estimates until they pull the oil pan to give the client a proper estimate. A crankshaft drifting forward and backwards in the block will surely break a tensioner rail. The tech who offers to replace that rail along with chains, tensioners, phazers, a valve job a water pump and a bunch of labor is quickly disappointed when he fires up the cars and hears the noises from the broken crank shims. This is not a bad engine. it is an engine with a lubrication flaw with the crankshaft thrustbearings that causes a lot of problems. Almost every engine the machine shop sees with timing chain problems seems to start at thecrankshaft thrust bearings allowing a loss of oil pressure. Fix the crank shims. use motorcraftoil and filters, use a little prolong, and you will get 300,000 miles. Not doing these things will have VERY BAD results. I hope this helps.