The truck has 185k miles, but otherwise seems to be in good shape. It was running really rough and throwing the cam sensor code, new cam sensors did not fix it. I pulled the valve covers and found one timing chain to be loose, so I replaced the chains, guides, phasers, tensioners and solenoids as well, all with FORD parts. It had a messed up phaser and both guides were broken.

I put the truck back together and it fired right up and ran like a top. I took it for a test drive and once it warmed up completely, it started running rough and rattling again.

I put a real oil pressure gauge on it and it would start up at 60psi (high idle), but by the time it would warm up it would drop to sub 20psi at idle in drive(about 500rpm).

I pulled the oil pan and there was surprisingly little sludge in it, although there were quite a few pieces of plastic from the broken guides. The oil pickup tube had a lot of crap on it though, it was about 90% covered with crude. I cleaned it all up and put it back together, happy that I had found the problem.

I fired it back up and it was pretty much the same deal. It worked fine when cold, but once completely up to operating temp, it would drop down below 20psi and knock. If I rev it up a little, then it builds pressure and the knock (from the phasers) goes away.

I dumped out the 5w20 and put in 10w30... hoping for a little more pressure with the thicker oil. Now with the changes it seems to start out at about 70psi, but still drops down to sub 20psi when warm and in gear at idle (500rpm).

I am at a loss to what to do next. I know that if I didn't get the chain tensioners on correctly they would leak, but I was pretty careful and wouldn't expect that to only leak when the temp was that high and to cause the oil pressure at the pump to drop that drastically. I thought that if they leaked the phases would rattle, but the oil pressure at the filter wouldn't drop to 20psi. Maybe I am wrong but I am not really excited about the hours of labor to get to those only to find out they aren't the problem.

Any other ideas? I really need to get this thing back together and in a drivable condition but I don't know what to do next (I have tried everything I have found reading past threads).

"Help me F150Online, your my only hope"

 

I was talking to some more people and beginning to think that maybe it is the oil pump. I have found a few different people with similar problems on different threads, but not too many solutions. Replacing the oil pump involves pulling all the timing again and pulling the oil pan again... quoted at 15 hours labor when I looked it up. :-(

 

Hey MrCarlson, I have an 04 FX4 5.4 3 valve that had similar issues with respect to pressure drop after warmup. I understand you pulled the pan and found the pickup tube to be clogged, as I'm curious if the material was aluminum from the timing chain rubbing the timing chain cover.

I replaced all timing components including cam phasers as well as a new oil pump. After assembly I got the same pressure drop after warmup. Like you, I developed a knock which eventually caused catastrophic failure to the front two rod bearings; throwing one through the oil pan.

After pulling the pan I discovered a huge amount of aluminum shavings in the bottom of the pan and who knows how much is still throughout the oil system.

After changing the timing components and before installing the new oil pump, I back flushed the pickup tube with 5 gallons of diesel letting it drain out the drain plug. I also flushed the pan as well as possible through the open ending with the timing cover still off. Once I felt everything had been flushed, I finished the assembly and filled with oil. After reaching running temp, the oil was changed again and driven 10 miles before it threw a rod.

In hind site, I should have flushed the entire system to remove all the aluminum shavings. The remaining shavings actually floated in the turbulent oil clogging the pickup tube by the time it reached warmup. During cool down the aluminum that was held in place by pump suction simply drifted back to the bottom of the pan only to repeat the process when warmed up again.

I don't feel your situation is exactly the same but I would certainly drain the oil and insert a camera into the drain hole to look for the presence of particulate matter such as aluminum shavings and plastic.

I also cut the end out of my oil filters and unrolled the filter paper and found them to contain quite a bit of aluminum shavings. Lastly, floating in both oil changes were very fine aluminum dust.

My advice, if the chains have cut into the timing cover, would be to flush the entire oil system and change both rod and main bearings since they will have been impregnated with aluminum dust.

Hope something out of my rambling helps. I just hate to see anyone else make the same mistake I made

 

Have you checked the cyl head oil drain back passages? Those passages can get sludge buildup to the point that it restricts the oil from returning to the oil pan fast enough and cause oil starvation to the pickup tube. Also the VCT system has screens that may need to be cleaned which could be giving you the knock. You shouldn't have a base engine knock at 20 psi idle. I have seen many test engines suddenly drop RPM from 6000-6500 sustained RPM for hours/days to 750 RPM and oil temps of 265 deg (much hotter than you will run) with 10-15 psi at that idle and never have a base engine knock. I have seen sub 10 psi at that oil temp and no engine knocks. Oil pump is giving you 60-70 psi at ambient temp which I suspect is fairly warm this time of year so it is working. Something is still being blocked it seems.

 

After reading a lot of forums regarding plug removal I was terrified at both paying someone the $700 +/- to do the job or choosing to do it myself; I opted for doing it myself.

I read Ford's 12 page bulletin on their recommended procedure and also bought the plug removal tool from NAPA that allows you to remove the cylindrical portion of the plug that is prone to break off.

End result was two plugs out of 8 broke off but the tool worked perfectly. I was careful to ensure that all the ceramic was intact on the broken plugs, therefore only the cylinder component was left in the head.

I would be lying if I said the job wasn't stressful but after it was all said and done, I'm confident that anyone with the ability to change out common spark plugs can change these plugs as well.

Hope this offers a little encouragement to anyone facing a plug change. Don't pay the thieves that created this inferior design their ridiculous price they ask; they should do it for free.

 

@Mr.Carlson, is the "knock" you are talking about just the characteristic "diesel knock" the 5.4L 3v is known for - and fills 90% of the writing space on these forums??


That's my take on it - given the things you described doing, ALL of which strikes me as completely logical and proper steps.


IMO - your oil pressure is GREAT on a 185,000 mile engine. Since you flushed diesel fuel down the valve cover cavaties, I don't believe you would have an oil starvation by restricted oil return. Otherwise I thnik @DYNOTECH is spot on correct in post #4, - you won't have a lower end knock -(only at idle)- with 20 lbs oil pressure at 500 RPM [which, by the way, is a fairly low idle speed]. Bearing and component stresses are so low at idle that you don't need more than about 7 lbs pressure -to avoid bearing knock. That's where the oil pressure switch is set to close (even though the DumbAss cluster gauge reads a consistent mid scale. A good article that confirming what @DYNOTECH says is at https://www.authcom.com/choosing-the-right-oil-pump/

Also, the ECU does not "enable" variable valve timing (or apply ANY duty cycle to the VCT Solenoids) until RPM reaches 800 - and the engine load exceeds 25%. I understand it takes 25 psi to push the phaser locking pins open to allow phasers to retard timing. I would bet your oil pressure is over 40 psi by 800-1000 rpm, mine is and it's north of 200,000.
As for oil viscosity, I decided to put 0W-40 in mine because, as you described my cold idle pressure would run at 70-71 with the 5w-20, but would drop to 18-20 Hot-Idle. With the 0w-40 it starts stone cold idle at about 60-63 and will Hot-Idle at 21-23.


(I may just be convincing MYSELF of this, but I think it idles smoother too !!!! ???)


I'm thinking the only thing you need to do to your 5.4L, is get some ear plugs, keep good oil in it, and drive it.

 

Congrats. However, that had absolutely nothing to do with the OP's thread or issue, that I do hope he's able to solve.

 

not only that but did the plug change come after it threw a rod in post number three where alumnum shavins floats but also sinks to the bottom

 

My 04 lariat 5.4 has 233,000 miles and I put a oil pressure test and it showed about 60 when I cold started it I'm in Ohio and its 80 degrees, and as it warmed up it got to 10 psi and I shut it off. I ordered a melling oil pump the m360 I think so I'm hoping it's just the pump and not a bad motor, any ideas or should I put new motor in?

 

Another instance where the correct cam phaser/timing chain/guides/tensioner update still did not solve the problem. Mine is totally quiet at 99K, and I'm running Mobil 1 EP with 1 year or about 1000 mile intervals. This truck is mostly a spare. Plus, I wanted a 4X4 for the occasional deep snow. If I start hearing engine noise, I'll either sell it promptly, or run it until it croaks and go with a Ford reman and high output oil pump. Hope the OP solves the problem without throwing any more money at it.

 

Original post was 4 years ago.

 

That is called the "ford death rattle". It plagues most 03 to 07 f150s with the 5.4. I learned that from having a ford mechanic friend look at my brother in laws 04 before i bought it. I was told it was caused by oil not making it to the top of the engine. I was also told that its best to just replace the engine once it starts knocking.

 

Looking for some suggestions... '08 F150 with the dreaded 54l 3v. did the timing job since it jumped timing when i let it "idle" one day when it was doing its rough idle.
Found a broken guide, gaskets on tensioners blown out, guide pieces in the oil pan. I replaced chains, sprockets, solenoids and guides. Also did new plugs and coils just because many were original. Installed the Melling 360 oil pump HV. Cleaned the oil pick up screen and tube. All followers looked fine, lashers fine, cams a little worn but didn't look too bad.
Got it all back together and ran just fine for about 1000 miles. The dreaded rough idle after stopping reared it's ugly head again. Runs fine down the highway until you need to come to a stop.
Pulled over and pulled the VCT connectors from the sols. Drove home that way and was OK.... just not much power.
where do I go from here? Throttle body? Sludge remover? I'll admit it... I didn't keep up with oil changes as often as I should have. Could I have some sludge cut loose from somewhere and get lodged somewhere else blocking the oil flow to VCTs?

 

Well your likely looking at your VCT's being clogged again. Sludge is the gift that keeps on giving most the time. You might be able to get away with removing them and cleaning the screens, but try running a cleaner in the oil first and change oil. There are a lot of small oil passages in the 5.4L 3V that fall subject to sludging.

 

This is the best desludger. Follow the directions.

https://www.auto-rx-plus.com