It's been raining quite a bit here in Houston these last two days and on my way to work this morning was no different. Quite a bit of rain and a lot of humidity.

So after I turn onto the toll road, I set my speed control for 65mph and drive - uninterrupted - like that for probably 20 miles until I approach a car going much slower. With the cruise-control still engaged, I punch the gas in an attempt to pass him up.

I am not sure what happened; I don't recall any loss of power; but immediately my engine light starts to flash on and off. I don't know how many flashes and/or for how long it flashed like that, but it seemed at least half a minute.

I take it off of cruise-control, yet the light remains flashing. Then, as sudden as it started flashing, it turned off and didn't flash since. I tried punching the gas a couple more times and experienced no further problems.

Now to add to this; this is a 2013 F150 I bought in July of this year with a build date of May 2013.

This isn't the dreaded ecoboost problem is it? I thought that was resolved by now?

Any suggestions/feedback would greatly be appreciated.

Thanks!

GM

 

Your description is a classic example of the ecoboost moisture issue. High humidity, steady state driving causes some condensation to build up. Punch the throttle and the jump in air flow sucks condensation into the engine.

Did the light disappear after shutting off and restarting the engine?

If the light is still there I would take it to a dealer and have them check the codes
Document everything!

 

Mine has done this once in 53k under similar conditions as you described. I have tried several times to make it happen again and can not do it. I think the trick is when the weather is crazy humid but not very hot to hit the throttle every once in a while to purge the intercooler. This will blow the moisture out of the intercooler before it builds up enough to cause a problem. If you're under warranty let the dealer look at it and see if you have the latest updates. However, after looking at the set-up I doubt the updates will make much of a change in the perfect conditions like you had.

The best solution would be to add a water separator to the intercooler to drain the water off or switch to twin intercoolers so the air velocity doesn't drop so much. For me neither seem like they're worth the trouble for something that happens every 50,000 miles.

 

Hey guys; thanks for the responses.

Since this happened on my way to work yesterday I couldn't do much more troubleshooting at the time, but when I was ready to go home, the truck started just fine and I had NO illuminated Check Engine light.

I did pull codes and it had a P0306 stored. Misfire in Cylinder 6.

This morning I went by the Ford dealership and had a good conversation with the Service Tech. Upon explaining the symptoms, the service tech started telling me this was a known issue and that it was caused by condensation buildup in the intercooler, which - upon sudden acceleration - gets sucked in the engine, in turn causing a misfire.

I then questioned him on how this could be. Telling them I was aware of the issues with the '11 and '12 models, but that the '13 model was supposed to have this fixed. According to the Tech, Ford has attempted to resolve this problem by putting what he called "dams" (I hope this is the correct spelling) on the intercoolers, essentially the plastic covering commonly described in the TSBs.

He told me my '13 does have this updated cooler (so the TSB doesn't apply here) but then went on to tell me that although this is a great improvement, it doesn't fully fix the problem and that in certain scenarios - especially on really wet and humid days in combination with the driving style (cruise for periods of time followed by sudden acceleration), the issue still occurs.

I told them that unlike the many stories I read on the internet, I did not experience heavy shutter, major lack of performance or some of the more serious symptoms people with the intercooler problem have described and asked him if it could have been anything else. He said "No, trust me, you suffered the same intercooler issue, but since you have the updated intercooler (with the dams) you had much less condensation build-up. You had it nonetheless (and it may happen again) but at least due to the lesser amount of condensation, the symptoms weren't as violent as with the '11 and '12 intercoolers".

When I asked him if Ford was aware the issue still remains - albeit less severe - he told me, "Yes, Ford is aware, they just haven't found a 100% solution yet".

I appreciate the honest and candid feedback I got from the Service Tech and believe what he told me. I am just shocked to hear Ford is aware of lingering intercooler issues and that unlike online reports (and those TSBs) the issue has in fact not yet been 100% fixed. :-(

GM

 

I’ll try to explain what is happening and why the current fix isn’t 100% effective.

The 3.5L is perfectly capable of moving the truck on its own without boost while driving down the highway. This is why it is capable of getting good mileage. When you’re just cruising down the road this is exactly what is going on. The turbos aren’t making any boost and the air in the charge pipes and intercooler are moving pretty slowly. However, the air still follows the same path through the intercooler which is sized to be large enough to do its job under the hottest of conditions. Here’s where the trouble starts. Humidity is measured in the air’s relative saturation of water vapor. When it is 100% humid it means the air is holding all the water vapor it can for that given temperature and pressure. If the temperature drops or the pressure changes water vapor will condensate out of the air. This is exactly what is happening in the intercooler of the EB. The air from outside is already completely saturated, and then it goes into the intercooler where the air velocity and temperature drop. This causes the water vapor to condensate and since the air velocity is not fast enough to keep the water droplets suspended in the air they drop to the bottom of the intercooler, simply put it starts raining. Now when you stomp on the skinny pedal the air starts moving a whole lot faster and sucks the water droplets back up and into the intake. We all know water doesn’t burn very well even so that is where the misfire comes from.

Now what can be done to stop this? From what I have seen the repair Ford has puts baffles in the intercooler to block the sudden surge of water when the boost pressure suddenly spikes. This eliminates the misfire when there’s not a ton of water in the intercooler but given enough water and boost it can still be sucked up into the intake.

A lot of other manufactures (my Audi is like this) use two intercoolers (one per turbo) to keep the air speeds higher under low/no boost conditions. This stops the water from separating and collecting in the intercooler but it is not perfect. One reason is that one large pipe flows much better than two small pipes due to the reduced wall friction. Also, the more pipes there are the more couplings and places to leak which can become a problem once the miles start to pile on. It also makes the under hood packaging more complex since there’s twice the piping to find a route for.

The intercooler could be reworked to add some type of water separator to it that will drain the water off once it starts to collect. This is a good plan and I would not by surprised to see it implemented on future trucks. However, it adds complexity to the overall system and isn’t a quick fix so adding it to in service vehicles isn’t as simple as adding a baffle.

The easiest, simplest and by far the cheapest solution is to hit the gas every once in a while when it’s extremely humid. This will flush out the water before it has a chance to build up and cause a misfire condition.

 

Excellent post, Wookie.

 

I agree ... great post Wook!. Thanks for the education, I appreciate it Sir.

 

^^^ x3 ^^^

Who knew that the Ewok could be so wordy?

Me, I prefer the simple approach - a picture...



Cheers

 

Thanks guys, in most of the posts about this subject the OP and all the e-hypochondriacs that immediately join in irritate me and I just leave without saying anything shaking my head. The OP seems like a reasonable guy and isn’t yelling stupid things like “we must have a mass recall for this before it kills all the children!” so it seemed worth the effort to explain it. Plus, it’s slow at work today. I think the issue has been blown way out of proportion. To me, it’s more of an annoyance than a real problem. One the other hand, my toy cars are two German cars renowned for their ability to make mechanics hair turn gray so I might be more forgiving than most.

I actually have an idea or two rolling around in my head for a way to make an active drain for the intercooler. But I haven’t messed with them because most of my car money and time has been going to my Audi lately. Plus I don’t want to risk messing up a good intercooler for a problem that has only happened to me once and is easily avoided.

 

Hehe, LOL wook! And yeah, I like to think I am a reasonable guy too. I am not a huge car fanatic, just a regular guy who just bought a new truck. The internet contains a wealth of information, but good and bad, that is why this thing caught me by surprise because everything I read (up until your post) made me believe it was a '11 and '12 only thing. Your post explained a lot to me.

In a way that is kinda sad too - because here is the kicker - I practically grew up in a garage. My dad worked for Volkswagen/Audi for over 45 years. He even received various, very rarely given, pins and recognitions from VW/Audi in Wolfsburg. In any case, I was always hanging out at the dealership, yet have a lick of knowledge on anything vehicle related and two left hands (when it comes to cars) to boot.

Instead, I am punching keys on a keyboard in an air conditioned room all day, developing software. I have a lot of respect for mechanics, hanging over hot engines all day. Funny thing, they often tell me how they can't see hoe I can stand being on a laptop 14 hrs a day. LOL.

But anyway. I digress. Thanks again for the great explanation.

Richard

 

Just a thought - couldn't they design a system that would bypass the intercooler electronically when not under boost or under low boost when the charge air temp is still low?

 

Green:
I have a similar but way different story. I grew up hanging around the shop too. My old man was a mechanic, body man, appraiser, body shop manager etc. I was always around the shop trying to figure things out. Pretty soon people started telling me I was way too smart to be a mechanic and I needed to go to school, so I did. Now with an Mechanical Engineering degree I sit at a desk all day and work on cars for fun.

GLC:
It could be done but it would open up more items that a consumer might not like. The bi-pass could be as simple as a pile and two electromechanical valves that went around the intercooler. But, when the valves opened there would be a drop in pressure as the intercooler pressurized which would create a surging feeling on acceleration. It would be much easier to add a sump and drain to the intercooler. From an OEM standpoint this would be pretty easy to do on a new design but difficult to retrofit.

 

Check your spark plug gapping, if it is moisture drill a small hole in the bottom of the CAC and be done with it.