Go Back   F150online Forums > F-Series Trucks > 1997 - 2003 F-150
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?


1997 - 2003 F-150 SPONSORED BY:

Reply
 
 
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 08-23-2010, 01:29 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Beaumont, TX
Vehicle: 2002 Ford F150
Posts: 85
Thinking about "tricking" my PATS system...

I remember reading that someone got a few keys cut for thier 97-03 truck that were not programmed and used one that WAS programmed to tape/adhere to the inside of the steering column so that the PATS system recognizes the key as present but the actual key being used is not programmed. This thereby eliminating the extreme cost of replacing a key if lost.

My question is this... When I worked for Volvo, I know that if you left the key in the ignition of any car 99+ for longer than xx minutes without starting it, it will "stop looking for they key" as its security immobilizer will override it thinking its an attempt at theft or a error. With our trucks, will perminantly having a key present cause the PATS system to "stop looking for they key signal"?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 08-23-2010, 02:10 PM
Goat Herder Extraordinaire
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: the moral high ground
Vehicle: 1999 Ford F150
Posts: 6,116
How many Pats keys do you have?
http://www.f150online.com/forums/art...pats-info.html

I bought a third programmed key from my dealer for $25.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 08-23-2010, 02:14 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Beaumont, TX
Vehicle: 2002 Ford F150
Posts: 85
I only have one... wich is why I am wanting to do this so badly. My wife almost lost this only key the other day and when I called my dealer, they told me it would have to be towed there and then have two new keys made. All in total (inc towing) was going to be close to $300 and I cringed. Luckily I found this key.

I just got one key made from the dealer this afternoon for $20 and they looked at me like I had two heads when I told them I didnt need it programmed. haha.
__________________

2002 F150 Supercrew 4x4- Cranked T-bars, K&N Filter, Flowmaster 40, weaksauce 4.6L, more to come!
2007 Mazda 6i SVE- Brake light mod, JDM Foglights, Intake silencer removed, Apexcone/DDM 55w 5000k HID.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 08-23-2010, 02:22 PM
MGDfan's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 9,604
Hmmm .... looks like, in the Ford PATS system the RFID subsystem is inactive until the ignition is in the "Start/Run" positions.

"A small electronic device, a transceiver, is mounted to the bottom of the steering column. It has a loop of wire that goes around the lock cylinder. When the key is put into the ignition cylinder, and turned to the run position, the transceiver sends out a small electronic signal to wake the key up. The key sends out a preset signal to the transceiver. If the transceiver recognizes the key, it will allow the car to start. If the key is not recognized, the car will not crank (if equipped that way) or it will crank but not start. In either case, the theft light will flash rapidly. All keys must be programmed into the PATS system. At the time of this article, the only scanners that can do this type of programming are the factory scanners ..."

So, presumably, yer idea *should* work; PATS surely cannot detect where that RFID chip actually is (either in the key itself or taped beside the loop antenna)

MGD

Last edited by MGDfan; 08-23-2010 at 02:25 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 08-23-2010, 02:27 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Beaumont, TX
Vehicle: 2002 Ford F150
Posts: 85
Imma give it a whirl and see what happens.

Thanks for the input. To see that some have done it gives me reason to attack it.
__________________

2002 F150 Supercrew 4x4- Cranked T-bars, K&N Filter, Flowmaster 40, weaksauce 4.6L, more to come!
2007 Mazda 6i SVE- Brake light mod, JDM Foglights, Intake silencer removed, Apexcone/DDM 55w 5000k HID.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 08-23-2010, 02:47 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 528
Lenn get back to the forums
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 08-23-2010, 05:39 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Beaumont, TX
Vehicle: 2002 Ford F150
Posts: 85
^ I'm everywhere, man! Haha.
__________________

2002 F150 Supercrew 4x4- Cranked T-bars, K&N Filter, Flowmaster 40, weaksauce 4.6L, more to come!
2007 Mazda 6i SVE- Brake light mod, JDM Foglights, Intake silencer removed, Apexcone/DDM 55w 5000k HID.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 08-23-2010, 06:57 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 22
Yes it should work. When I had a remote starter there was a spare key in the unit under the dash with a loop around the key cylinder. It was left in all the time.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 08-23-2010, 07:00 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Beaumont, TX
Vehicle: 2002 Ford F150
Posts: 85
Last question... How far down up the plastic part of the key is the transponder? I wanna put a key inside a holder under the truck somewhere but the key itself is too big. I want to cut it down so that I can adhere the transponder portion to the ring area and then use the actual metal key portion as a spare.
__________________

2002 F150 Supercrew 4x4- Cranked T-bars, K&N Filter, Flowmaster 40, weaksauce 4.6L, more to come!
2007 Mazda 6i SVE- Brake light mod, JDM Foglights, Intake silencer removed, Apexcone/DDM 55w 5000k HID.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 08-23-2010, 08:26 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: St. Louis (Out in the woods)
Vehicle: 2001 Ford F250 6.8
Posts: 5,254
I can assure you that there is no adverse effect to the PATS system for leaving a PATS key permanently affixed to the antenna ring. I would, however, recommend removing the ring from the cylinder, zip-tieing the key into the ring, then securing the whole thing up under the dash way out of the way.

Ahem... Don't ask me how I know this...

The PATS bypass modules used in remote starters inductively couples the PATS system antenna to the antenna coil that is placed around the hidden hey. The key's transponder is 'tickled' only during the starting sequence when the vehicle PATS system needs to interrogate the RFID tag.
__________________
If your original owner's manual is missing, download a soft copy from www.fleet.ford.com under the MAINTENANCE tab.

1995 Mustang GT Convertible, only 68K miles.
200 Ford Contour Daily drive.
2001 F250 SD, 6.8L, 4 X4.
2007 Mercury Mariner AWD - Wifey's daily driver
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-02-2011, 04:20 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Vehicle: 2003 Ford F150
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lenn02Screw View Post
Last question... How far down up the plastic part of the key is the transponder? I wanna put a key inside a holder under the truck somewhere but the key itself is too big. I want to cut it down so that I can adhere the transponder portion to the ring area and then use the actual metal key portion as a spare.
If you look at your key you will see a cover on one side of the key head. I think the chip is located under that inside the head.

I just bought two keys at Walmart for $1.67 each cut to match my one programed chip key. They are 24R blanks and have a small rubber head, no chip. I wouldn't destroy the only good complete key I had. If I ever sell the truck I would be able to give the new owner a good working key in case they did not want the security bypass. I am still not sure how I will place my one working key inside the steering column to trick the system on start up. Hopefully it will become clear when I remove the cover and locate the loop.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-02-2011, 05:52 PM
JMC JMC is offline
Technical Article Contributor
 
Join Date: Dec 1997
Location: Windsor,Ontario,Canada
Vehicle: 2000 Ford F-150 4x4
Posts: 9,351
Send a message via ICQ to JMC
Most competent locksmiths now carry the tools to program an extra key. They are a lot cheaper than the dealer. If you have a tuner or a chip you can have the PATS disabled in the tune.
__________________
Regards
Jean Marc Chartier


4.6 to 5.4 swap, M5OD w/ Hurst short throw, Warn XD9000i, OBX Long Tubes /w Cats, Troyer E-fans, P-1SC Procharger @15psi, Troyer tuned. ;)
Swap notes; http://www.f150online.com/forums/art...ml#post3570245
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-07-2011, 06:42 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: LAKELAND FLORIDA
Vehicle: 2001 FORD F150
Posts: 168
You need the Key 1 and Key 2 programmed for your truck if you are having PATS work done at a dealership, if not they will have to make a new one. If you can get another chipped key for it (like if you lost the keys but found them after you got new Ford keys made) then you can code the old keys to your truck even though it has been reprogrammed. Put the key in, turn it forward for 3-5 seconds, roll key back, put in 2nd key, roll key forward for 3-5 seconds then roll it back and after that just repeat the same process on any keys you want to code to the truck. You cannot do this with a programmed key and cloned key, they have too both be programmed keys to start the process.

Or what you can do is just cut a coded key open and tape the "chip" as close to possible to the transmitter and any key that will fit the truck will start it...

I went to have my PATS system reflashed yesterday at Bartow Ford because I installed a new gauge cluster in the truck, well to do the reflash you have to have both keys or they can't do it. I had to have them make me a new key, which was only 30 bucks on top of the 93 dollar reflash. The Ford Tech doing the reflash yesterday told me how to do both of the things I posted above...

I have left the keys in my truck for along time. It has never caused any problems...
Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2011, 06:42 PM


 
 
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:22 AM.





This forum is owned and operated by Internet Brands, Inc., a Delaware corporation. It is not authorized or endorsed by the Ford Motor Company and is not affiliated with the Ford Motor Company or its related companies in any way. FordŽ is a registered trademark of the Ford Motor Company
 
Contact Us Advertising Privacy Statement Terms of Service Jobs Forum Text Archives
Emails & Contact Details